Electronic Ignition Conversion on a DELCO distributor

[danmiddle2]

Hi there,

This subject seems to have been covered fairly comprehensively with regards to the Bosch distributor system that came fitted to most Opel GT's... but I have a 1971 1.9 CIH Opel GT which has a Delco Distributor, not a Bosch.

I would like to convert the ignition to an electronic ignition to get rid of the points and condenser etc.

I have read and searched a lot, both in this site and others.. but does anyone know of a kit that I can use to do this?

I purchased a Pertronix 1149C kit which I was told would work... but they have just agreed to refund me and cannot supply a kit that will work.

The other option I have heard of is to find a Bosch electronic ignition kit from a number of other European cars, which is a direct replacement and is already electronic. Does anyone have any details of what cars this would have been fitted to, or ideally, a part number? I am based in the UK, so sourcing it once I know what I am looking for should be fairly straightforward.

Many thanks

Dan

[RallyBob]

Originally Posted by danmiddle2 Hi there, This subject seems to have been covered fairly comprehensively with regards to the Bosch distributor system that came fitted to most Opel GT's... but I have a 1971 1.9 CIH Opel GT which has a Delco Distributor, not a Bosch. I would like to convert the ignition to an electronic ignition to get rid of the points and condenser etc. I have read and searched a lot, both in this site and others.. but does anyone know of a kit that I can use to do this? I purchased a Pertronix 1149C kit which I was told would work... but they have just agreed to refund me and cannot supply a kit that will work. The other option I have heard of is to find a Bosch electronic ignition kit from a number of other European cars, which is a direct replacement and is already electronic. Does anyone have any details of what cars this would have been fitted to, or ideally, a part number? I am based in the UK, so sourcing it once I know what I am looking for should be fairly straightforward. Many thanks Dan

I have a Bosch electronic ignition conversion I bought in Germany in 1984. It was very expensive then, now it probably costs 300€ or more...if it is still available! It consisted of a higher energy ignition box, a special ignition rotor, new red coil, and a dust cap/spacer for under the dizzy cap. Worked quite nicely as I recall, but that car has been parked for 20 years now!

However I *believe* it was a standard item for the Manta B 2.0 litre CIH, not sure of which years it fits. I seem to remember it also fit some models of Audi, VW, Alfa Romeo, BMW, etc. I wish I could help you with the part number, but I threw the parts box away some time ago.

HTH,
Bob

[CDN OpelNut]

Is it an option to buy the bosch distributor assembly and start from there or is there further differences in the motor?

[danmiddle2]

Originally Posted by CDN OpelNut Is it an option to buy the bosch distributor assembly and start from there or is there further differences in the motor?

I believe that distributor fitted to Mantas etc is the same as the Bosch fitted to the GT... but is already an electronic ignition version of it... so i am trying to bypass the conversion step if possible.

Many thanks

dan

[danmiddle2]

Originally Posted by RallyBob I have a Bosch electronic ignition conversion I bought in Germany in 1984. It was very expensive then, now it probably costs 300€ or more...if it is still available! It consisted of a higher energy ignition box, a special ignition rotor, new red coil, and a dust cap/spacer for under the dizzy cap. Worked quite nicely as I recall, but that car has been parked for 20 years now! However I *believe* it was a standard item for the Manta B 2.0 litre CIH, not sure of which years it fits. I seem to remember it also fit some models of Audi, VW, Alfa Romeo, BMW, etc. I wish I could help you with the part number, but I threw the parts box away some time ago. HTH, Bob

Thanks for the info bob, I don't suppose you could get any pics or see if there is a number on the distributor itself?

Many thanks

Dan

[GTJIM]

Yep - Opel used both Bosch and Delco distributors - they interchange but are different internally.

Also, the later Manta electronic distributors have often been available rebuilt on eBayuk for less than 20 quid. Just be sure you get the earlier version as late 1980's ones do not have advance weights and rely upon the ECU to adjust ignition advance. You will also need the amplifier module, the wiring loom and the correct hi-voltage coil to run the Manta electronic distributor. They drop straight in to the 1.9L motor ... and even have a fuel pump cam on them too.

[RallyBob]

Originally Posted by danmiddle2 Thanks for the info bob, I don't suppose you could get any pics or see if there is a number on the distributor itself? Many thanks Dan

I have no pics at this time, but the distributor number wouldn't help you at all either...it was a conversion kit, it fit inside my old Bosch distributor!

[markandson]

Why not just get a Bosch dizzy and drop it in with a Pertronix unit installed, seems like that would be much easier.

[danmiddle2]

Originally Posted by markandson Why not just get a Bosch dizzy and drop it in with a Pertronix unit installed, seems like that would be much easier.

I may end up doing that - I have just heard that I am more likely to find this bosch kit from other Opels etc in the UK as they came fitted to more cars... and bypass the need to convert as well. If I could get hold of a bosch dizzy I would certainly consider it.

The ideal situation for me would be to find a kit that works with my Delco, however, but that is looking increasingly unlikely.

I am also trying to minimise the amount of work; It's becoming a very steep learning curve... this is my first car with a carb, for example. Although not that young anymore, I am young enough that i have never had to do points, rebuild a carb etc... I have previously been more at home with tailoring fuel maps for ECU's and the like.

I am willing and still keen - I have already replaced the original carb with a twin choke weber 32/36 DGV and replaced and restored the fuel tank and all the associated fuel lines. I have also just ordered a new rad, thermostat and kenlo electric fan to sort out the cooling and many other odd jobs!

It would just have been nice to find an electronic ignition kit for what I've got so as to minimise replacing bits and maximising driving it!

Many thanks for the info though - it's all useful

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by danmiddle2 I may end up doing that - I have just heard that I am more likely to find this bosch kit from other Opels etc in the UK as they came fitted to more cars... and bypass the need to convert as well. If I could get hold of a bosch dizzy I would certainly consider it. The ideal situation for me would be to find a kit that works with my Delco, however, but that is looking increasingly unlikely. I am also trying to minimise the amount of work; It's becoming a very steep learning curve... this is my first car with a carb, for example. Although not that young anymore, I am young enough that i have never had to do points, rebuild a carb etc... I have previously been more at home with tailoring fuel maps for ECU's and the like. I am willing and still keen - I have already replaced the original carb with a twin choke weber 32/36 DGV and replaced and restored the fuel tank and all the associated fuel lines. I have also just ordered a new rad, thermostat and kenlo electric fan to sort out the cooling and many other odd jobs! It would just have been nice to find an electronic ignition kit for what I've got so as to minimise replacing bits and maximising driving it! Many thanks for the info though - it's all useful

Dan, just thinking "out-loud" here for a moment, but Pertronix has only a single Ignitor listing for early GM 4-cylinder OHV engines with Delco distis. Why wouldn't that one, an 1144A, work? . . . I can't imagine GM/Delco designing an "internally" totally unique 4-cyl distributor just for their Opel subsidiary's CIH engines!! After all, GM likes to standardize their "periodic maintenance/tuning" replacement parts as much as possible!

The Pertronix Ignition Catalog in PDF format is downloadable, just click!

It lists: Chevrolet 1962-74/GMC Truck 1964-66/Pontiac 1962-63 - All 4cyl with Delco distis - Ignitor 1144A . . . and not the 1149C (Triumph 4-cyl w. Delco) they told you in your first post!

[KN6VV]

Originally Posted by tekenaar Dan, just thinking "out-loud" here for a moment, but Pertronix has only a single Ignitor listing for early GM 4-cylinder OHV engines with Delco distis. Why wouldn't that one, an 1144A, work? . . . I can't imagine GM/Delco designing an "internally" totally unique 4-cyl distributor just for their Opel subsidiary's CIH engines!! After all, GM likes to standardize their "periodic maintenance/tuning" replacement parts as much as possible! The Pertronix Ignition Catalog in PDF format is downloadable, just click! It lists: Chevrolet 1962-74/GMC Truck 1964-66/Pontiac 1962-63 - All 4cyl with Delco distis - Ignitor 1144A . . . and not the 1149C (Triumph 4-cyl w. Delco) :o: they told you in your first post!

Wow guys, you got me nervous here. My first opel GT finally arrived today from the transport folks and I had already ordered the Pertronix kit for it - 1.9 engine and the number I was told for the 1.9 was 1847V, a 4 cylinder kit for Bosch systems. I found it on Ebay new from a Pertronix dealer for $65 who said it was for the Opel, and many other 4 cylinder inports, at least 30 or more listed but all Bosch systems, not Delco. The Delco system is new to me and as others have said maybe much harder to find. I don't recall seeing one Delco for 4 cylinder setups and my dealer did not even ask if I had a Delco [CIH - rarely used!] when looking my part number up.

The Ebay seller I bought from does not have it listed anymore so maybe mine was the last one. At $65 I thought it to be a great price but there are other sellers with the 1847V so maybe you could look at there specs to verify the correct part number.

I'm unable to go out there and install it for awhile. Here I was waiting patiently to get in my first Opel GT to arrive today and drive it for a few days before I start the restore process when I had to go out and snowthrow 3-4 inches of snow off the driveway Sunday morning. Falling badly on a patch of ice resulted in my surgery yesterday for several screws and a metal plate in my ankle. I'm not sure which hurts more, the injury or looking at my beauty in the driveway and unable to drive it for 8 weeks!! I guess if it were an automatic my left ankle could rest while I use my good foot for the gas/brake!

Good luck in finding your setup.

[tekenaar]

. . . apples vs. oranges! . . . Delco vs. Bosch CIH distributor triggering internals - different component (points/cam) mounting and dimensions! . . . ergo, different Ignitor trigger P/Ns required!

[kwilford]

Originally Posted by KN6VV Wow guys, you got me nervous here. My first opel GT finally arrived today from the transport folks and I had already ordered the Pertronix kit for it - 1.9 engine and the number I was told for the 1.9 was 1847V, a 4 cylinder kit for Bosch systems. I found it on Ebay new from a Pertronix dealer for $65 who said it was for the Opel, and many other 4 cylinder inports, at least 30 or more listed but all Bosch systems, not Delco. The Delco system is new to me and as others have said maybe much harder to find. I don't recall seeing one Delco for 4 cylinder setups and my dealer did not even ask if I had a Delco [CIH - rarely used!] when looking my part number up. The Ebay seller I bought from does not have it listed anymore so maybe mine was the last one. At $65 I thought it to be a great price but there are other sellers with the 1847V so maybe you could look at there specs to verify the correct part number.

As I think Otto tried to demonstrate in his edit of your post, the Delco distributor is virtually non-existent in Opels in North America, because AFAIK all the officially imported Opels came with the Bosch distributor. Now if your car was a grey market Euro import, it might have come with the Delco dizzy. And one thing to watch for are distributor caps for sale on eBay that are for the Delco distributor. I know this because I bought one, from a place I have bought Opel parts from several times before. They sometimes get European New Old Stock, and hence happened to have a Delco dizzy cap.

HTH

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by kwilford As I think Otto tried to demonstrate in his edit of your post, the Delco distributor is virtually non-existent in Opels in North America, because AFAIK all the officially imported Opels came with the Bosch distributor. Now if your car was a grey market Euro import, it might have come with the Delco dizzy. And one thing to watch for are distributor caps for sale on eBay that are for the Delco distributor. I know this because I bought one, from a place I have bought Opel parts from several times before. They sometimes get European New Old Stock, and hence happened to have a Delco dizzy cap. HTH

. . . just a second thought on replacement cap/rotors for the CIH Delco dizzy here, maybe check any of the "Chevrolet 1962-74/GMC Truck 1964-66/Pontiac 1962-63 - All 4-cyl OHV engines with Delco dizzy" for proper fit? . . . much more prevalent and easier to locate States-side than the odd-ball CIH with Delco dizzy combo, I would think!

[justrick]

Hi Dan

For my 1.9 CIH I use the electronic ignition from a 1983 Opel Rekord 2.0S and it fits perfect.

Distributor - Bosch 0237020042
Transistor unit - Bosch 1227022008
Coil - Bosch 1227020009

[danmiddle2]

Originally Posted by justrick Hi Dan For my 1.9 CIH I use the electronic ignition from a 1983 Opel Rekord 2.0S and it fits perfect. Distributor - Bosch 0237020042 Transistor unit - Bosch 1227022008 Coil - Bosch 1227020009

Excellent. Thanks

[danmiddle2]

Originally Posted by tekenaar Dan, just thinking "out-loud" here for a moment, but Pertronix has only a single Ignitor listing for early GM 4-cylinder OHV engines with Delco distis. Why wouldn't that one, an 1144A, work? . . . I can't imagine GM/Delco designing an "internally" totally unique 4-cyl distributor just for their Opel subsidiary's CIH engines!! After all, GM likes to standardize their "periodic maintenance/tuning" replacement parts as much as possible! The Pertronix Ignition Catalog in PDF format is downloadable, just click! It lists: Chevrolet 1962-74/GMC Truck 1964-66/Pontiac 1962-63 - All 4cyl with Delco distis - Ignitor 1144A . . . and not the 1149C (Triumph 4-cyl w. Delco) they told you in your first post!

Thanks for the suggestion. I have asked the seller to swap for this kit instead of issuing a refund. I will document, photograph and post instructions should it work!

[Manta1900PT]

Hi Dan.

Any news?

I´m having same problem as you...

i have the delco distributor on my 1973 manta 1.9 cih and im looking for a pertronix or an electronic dizzy... the electronic dizzy is more easy to find...

Did the pertronix fitted good the delco distributor?

[danmiddle2]

Originally Posted by Manta1900PT Hi Dan. Any news? I´m having same problem as you... i have the delco distributor on my 1973 manta 1.9 cih and im looking for a pertronix or an electronic dizzy... the electronic dizzy is more easy to find... Did the pertronix fitted good the delco distributor?

Hi,

No good news I'm afraid. I tried various electronic ignition kits, 3 different pertronix, a couple of lumenition and another one. Basically... none of them come close to fitting and all went back for refunds :-(. I am keeping an eye out for a Bosch dizzy to buy. I would be happy with either an electronic or one that needs converting! (Beggers can't be choosers!), but I have mastered points now, so I am in no rush at all!

Dan

[Manta1900PT]

Thakns Dan.

I think i´m also going to get a bosch distributor, but i think i will go directly to the electronic one.

Thanks for your reply.

I have on my manta a 1900 cih 2 webers dcoes and i already advance the ignition but i still notice that the fuel isn´t all "burned" in the explosion, because my spark plugs are too black...

At thos point i´m trying to find the best ºs of advance...

rgds,

Pedro

[BQS4]

Originally Posted by danmiddle2 I am keeping an eye out for a Bosch dizzy to buy. I would be happy with either an electronic or one that needs converting! (Beggers can't be choosers!), but I have mastered points now, so I am in no rush at all! Dan

Are you wanting the BOSCH 009 dist that we got here in the US? If so, how many you want?

[wrench459]

Originally Posted by Manta1900PT Thakns Dan. I have on my manta a 1900 cih 2 webers dcoes and i already advance the ignition but i still notice that the fuel isn´t all "burned" in the explosion, because my spark plugs are too black... At thos point i´m trying to find the best ºs of advance... Pedro

I would start by putting a safe timing curve into dist. first.
Then work on the fuel mixture for the side drafts. After you get the A/F ratios where you want them.. then start adding back timing until the torque starts to drop off.From there on in its all tweeking this and that to get the optimum timing.