wheel bearings

[opeldean]

small wham..then grinding sounds..loud...
scared me as I was doing 65mph on the 4 lane ..in heavy traffic and no shoulder... I hopped on the curb of a divided highway and hoped I didnt get rear ended...I was a couple miles or so from my friends shop..I made it there ..he rode in it and said it was wheel bearing..

he said "add oil"..I was 1/2 quart low!..then dump oil at home and we will see how much metal is in the oil...

I made it home...

question 1- best way to get oil out of differential?..i dont seee a drain plug..do I need a pump?

question 2- I assume my axle is a 70..since my car is a 70..

How to confirm Id of Axle?

enough excitement for the day...


question 3- maybe I have the cart before the horse..

since 70 bearings are not available..How do I get what I need to kansas city mo?I assume I need to ship or go pick up an axle

thanks

[baz]

if you can get the dimentions of the bearing you can go to a supplier and get any one that matches
as long as the inside / outside /thickness and any seals match
or if you get the bearing number then they will be able to match it from that

[kwilford]

I moved this to the "Differential" forum, until we find out if is a differential problem or an axle bearing failure ("Axles Forum") .

The earlier differential design is easily identified. Look for the vent on top of the passenger side axle housing. If it has a steel cap (kind of star-shaped), then you have the earlier differential (circlip in the gear set holds the axle in place, and the outer axle bearing is a roller type, that rides right on the axle shaft, and a separate outer oil seal)

The later differential has a plastic vent cap. That design uses a pressed-on retainer ring that secures the outer bearing to the axle shaft, and the bearing is a integral unit with a built in seal and inner race.

If you have a '70, it is probably the older style (unless the build date is after March, I believe, 1970, but after VIN # 94-2264500). But what you describe could also be a piled up differential gear. To drain the differential, the lower cover bolt is also a drain. But you might as well pull the cover completely off and inspect the gear set while you are at it. In fact, if you have the older diff, remove the circlip and axle and inspect the axle and bearing.

I see as I edit this with the chassis change number that RallyBob and I had posted at virtually the same time (I beat him by two whole minutes!). Bob, do you know what build date corresponded to the change in the differential design?

Good luck!

[RallyBob]

To drain the rear axle, simply remove the lowest bolt on the rear diff cover. It'll trickle out...unless there's something physically blocking the hole (such as metal or gasket sealer).

Regarding the axle bearings Baz, those are no longer available for the pre '71 axles. Not from Opel , not from FAG, nor BCA, or any other aftermarket suppliers I've heard of. They've been discontinued for about 20 years, although occasionally a European supplier finds an old stash in some warehouse or dealership, then charges appropriate prices ($100-$200 each). Of course, if the bearing has failed, it will destroy the axle itself as those early rear axle bearings rode directly on the axle, no inner race!

Once the gear oil is drained from the diff, you can remove the rear cover, and from this you can tell if it's an early or late axle. Where the axles enter the differential itself, it'll have a 'C' clip to retain each axle in place if it's an early axle. Later axles do not have the clip.

HTH
Bob

[bear]

have you tried OGTS for the bearing? if not try opels unlimited, just be patient when ordering from Unlimted, kinda hard to get a hold of but they have a LOT!!!! of hard to get stuff.
Good luck

[opeldean]

1-if this is a true 70..bearings are unavailible

2- "nobody" has an axel for me in colorado

3- ogts has neither bearings or axels..spoke to Gil today..he is always so helpful.

4-I may find an axel closer..St loius? rumor of an opel in Gardner ks...maybe Ksgt.mjewell and myself will cut up a $300 gt..we are close to the gardner savlage yard
..

here is where I am stopping for the night...Dam!..I blame myself for not keeping track of oil level..it wasnt leaking...

[kwilford]

Bucky,

Re-read my post above (I edited it) regarding identification of the differential design. Then pull off the cover and look inside. It takes about ten minutes, and it may tell the whole story. And post a photo so we can share the pain. Or the relief...

[namba209]

Bucky, you're not gonna like this, I just checked my owner's manual and the differential only holds 2 1/2 pints, and you put one pint in today. I'm guessing the bearing ran dry. Sorry for the bad news. I had the rear bearing go bad on my GT some years ago, it got so hot my wheel was smoking. I found a bearing at a local supplier and installed it. When I go my posi put in, the whole rear-end was rebuilt by the pros. I don't want to go down that road again.

Ron

[ksgt]

Hey bucky, I have another rear end out behind the shop. If it ever quits raining I'll go take a look and find out if it is older or newer. I like the idea on the Gardner opel. Let's offer low and get parts for all of our GT's. I have a place we can store it and chop it up. Also have flatbed trailer that hauls GT's great.
If you need this rear end let me know.

[opeldean]

what do you guys think?

rally bob ..can you tell by just looking?

[wayne70gt]

I have a 70 and needed to replace a rear seal that was leaking. Unsure which rearend I had I called OGTS. I was told that instead of removeing the differential cover you could tell by the bolts inside the brake drum around the axle. In the earlier style the bolt spaceing between the bottom two is narrower then the top two. In the later model they were the same. Mine were narrower thus it was the earlier style. It was right in my case. Saved haveing to remove the cover until I replaced the seal.

Wayne

[wayne70gt]

Bucky,

Looking at the picture, if you turn the differential a quarter turn and see a "C" clip on the end of the axle, then it is the early style.

Wayne

[opeldean]

wayne..is this the clip? Is this a 70 rear end?

[RallyBob]

Yup, that's one of the clips. Definitely an early rear axle.

[GTJIM]

1) Check the outside diameter for the original 1969-70 roller wheel bearing also the depth of the recess in the axle housing that it fits in.

2) Measure the size of the axle where the roller bearing runs on it.

3) See if there is a conventional wheel bearing that can be made to fit these sizes. Maybe necessary to turn/grind the axle to a standard size.

For instance the Isuzu Impulse wheel bearing is of a similar type to the later Opel GT one but has a smaller bore where it fits onto the axle.

OD = 72.00 mm - same as later GT bearing

ID = 35.00mm which is smaller that the later GT which has 41.50mm ID

Width = 21.00mm - same as later GT

With a bit of luck some other conventional bearing may be made to fit the earlier GT roller bearing axle.

If all else fails then the ends of the diff housing could be cut off and Isuzu Impulse ends welded on so that Impulse bearings could be used on turned down GT axles - and the Isuzu rear discs would now be a bolt on

[opeldean]

is there any salvage left in my 70 axle? would anyone want the one good
bearing? or do I just throw the whole rear end away?

my plan is to find a 71 or later rear end..then inspect it and see what parts
i keep or switch over...brakes ,etc...

[GTJIM]

Bucky,

When living on a couple of islands in the middle of the Pacific Ocean that is 1,200 miles from Australia and 4,000 miles from West Coast United States - nothing gets thrown away!

Have a look at my immeadiately previous post and also think that the good axle/bearing could "fix" another early diff (I see you have thought of that!).

Yes, obtaining a later diff is probably your best bet over there though.

Jay Dee

[Old Hippie]

Bucky, just to add comment. I've found, like Ron suggested, that taking a bearing to a "Bearing House", they can usually find replacements for them. I got a bearing for a Old 40's Jeep i had long ago in Jersey, by letting a shop do a search for me. It might be better to try that first. If they find a replacement for you, you can overhaul your axle and save the spares from the Gardner GT for a castastrophic problem.

[namba209]

Bucky, I was on the Yahoo chat room last Satruday and got the numbers off an old style axle bearing from one of the folks on the chat room. (Senior Moment, I can't remember who it was), any way I'll give the bearing supply house a call tomorrow, late morning, and see if they can fix me up with a bearing. What would be really nice is to have the dimensions of the bearing, ie., OD, ID, thickness, either in inches, thousandsth would be nice, or metric. That way I could double check that the bearing will or will not work. BTW the numbers I got are: 8953132, 4 14 318, and 28923 8 953 132. Aha, looking at the last number, the first five digits are the manufacturers military ID code. HTH

Ron

[nobody]

Does anybody have a number and a maker for this elusive bearing? Looking in the list I see a Timken RW105R is this it?

[GTJIM]

RW105R sounds like the same bearing as used in early 1957-59 Ford 9" diffs.
Also Holdens 1964-71. I have a couple of those bearings at my workshop so will drag them out and measure them .... tomorrow.

[opeldean]

[QUOTE=kwilford]The earlier differential design is easily identified. Look for the vent on top of the passenger side axle housing. If it has a steel cap (kind of star-shaped), then you have the earlier differential (circlip in the gear set holds the axle in place, and the outer axle bearing is a roller type, that rides right on the axle shaft, and a separate outer oil seal)

I was a able to find an axle close by...looks like the older one...wouldnt it be easiest to take a bearing and the axle out of the one pictured and put it in my car? the repair part is pretty rusty.

[opeldean]

metal wire comes out top

[opeldean]

ok..here is what i got to get celeste back on the road.

i got what i believe is an old axle that is a match to existing axle..here is my replacement part.


last night..I invited the mo-ks folks for a barn raising at my house..if you are reading the words on this page, you are invited too..its a last minute deal...

"old hippie" got the ball rolling..he offered to help me...and yes "I need it"...

mjewell,ksgt are going to swing by too,chouser is working in texas and cant make it..

last night after taking care of the usual family stuff,I drove to ksgts last night to pick up the mystery axle.. ..(wow..were the stars beautiful away from the city lights..ksgt lives in lane,ks..) we had a nice visit...I got the axel
back last night and here it is..

we start woking on celeste at 1:30pm on sat ..i will order in sandwiches from a great spot ...

my address is 12614 w 121 st St
overland park ks
66213
name dean elledge(bucky)

I am 2 blocks south of johnson county community colllege..turn s on rosehill

cell 816 853 2207..call if you can make it.

[MICAH1]

Dang Bucky,
Wish I were close to your location. Would love that hands on learning experience and the down home sandwich throw down.......