remove Solex add Weber,remove linkages
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Thread: remove Solex add Weber,remove linkages

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    70wagon 70wagon's Avatar
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    remove Solex add Weber,remove linkages

    I took my Solex off and bought a 32/36 weber dgav on ebay with air filter for $100 used. This was a great buy, the car is a whole new animal now. My 1.9L is getting with it, and its a wagon. Follow my short list of steps you will be glad. You DO NOT need any adapters whatsoever, bolt straight on!!!
    1)Remove solex carb.
    2)*remove the clumsy linkage system and go to a cable throttle*
    3)get some make a gasket material. You will need thicker gasket than factory. Use old gasket to trace it out, use sharp knife to cut out gasket, do not use any sealants
    4)install new weber.
    5) I added a pull choke, not crazy about hot water going to my carb. You can buy aftermarket pull choke cable setup. The weber I bought was ready for a pull choke.
    Before I did this my car was as slow as a golf cart, now I am the first one out once the light turns green.
    ***** change from linkage to cable. I went to junk yard bought a throttle cable off some wrecked car. Does not matter make or model, just get cable long enough. I was able to keep factory gas pedal and attached my cable to the pedal assm where it comes from cockpit to firewall. I had to make some brackets and bolt to car to mount the cable, it must be fastened tight to car with no slack. look at design on junk car before removing. Trust me, this cable deal is worth the 2 hours you may have to invest. That linkage system is so mickey mouse you are losing loads of power!!!
    Good luck!!!
    Dave,,,

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    Cunning Linguist Site Supporter My location tekenaar's Avatar
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    QuestionConfused, please explain! . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by 70wagon View Post
    I took my Solex off and bought a 32/36 weber dgav on ebay with air filter . . .
    Before I did this my car was as slow as a golf cart, now I am the first one out once the light turns green.

    ***** change from linkage to cable. . . . Trust me, this cable deal is worth the 2 hours you may have to invest. That linkage system is so mickey mouse you are losing loads of power!!!

    Dave,,,
    I'm impressed . . . please explain in detail how you gained "loads of power" by merely swapping linkages!? . . . and perhaps also the benefits of a 'hot air intake' (atop replacement carb) versus a 'cold air intake' (stock)?


    1960: '61 Rekord PII 1.7 3S 3.9 '69 Kadett LS 'sprint' 1.9 3A 3.18
    1970: '70 GT 1.9 4S 3.44 '72 GT 2.2SSD 5S 3.44 '72 GT 2.4FI 5S 3.44P
    1970: '73 GT 1.9FI 4S 3.44 '75 1900 1.9FI 4S 3.44
    1980: '85 Bitter SC 3.9FI 5S 3.44P
    2000: '09 Solstice GXP Coupe 2.0 SIDI VVT "Stage 2" Turbo 5S 3.73P


    "De inimico non tantum loquaris male, sed cogites."

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    Member My location West Coast GT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tekenaar View Post
    I'm impressed . . . please explain in detail how you gained "loads of power" by merely swapping linkages!? . . . and perhaps also the benefits of a 'hot air intake' (atop replacement carb) versus a 'cold air intake' (stock)?
    I suspect we're talking a combination of increased power, increased response, and increased tuning.

    Power – even without porting the intake or other modifications, the 32/36 can enhance the engine’s performance simply by virtue of getting more air/fuel into the system. I agree, though, the original intake snorkle can't be beat.

    Response – Forty year old mechanical linkage can have a lot of slop in it as the grommets wear out, creating binding and excessive play. Eliminating this slop via a throttle cable can feel like the engine’s response is much quicker.

    Tuning – I’ve found that the Solex carburetor, as well as the Weber, due to the linkage slop mentioned above and due to bad carb’s poorly adjusted linkage sometimes does not allow the secondary throttle to open fully. By installing the throttle cable, and assuming the Weber’s own linkage was properly adjusted, that secondary may finally be opening and, again, making it feel as though it has more power.

    Come on Tekenaar, you’re damn near genius with these carbs; you could write the book on this stuff. Let’s not bait good folks who’re just giving us ideas and tips. You’re better than that. Way better.

    And I do thank you for all the advice you’ve given me over the years. My car would have been sitting idle without it.

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    Cunning Linguist Site Supporter My location tekenaar's Avatar
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    TalkingTIC reply . . .

    Hmmm . . . my reply was merely meant as 'tongue-in-cheek', nothing more, guess that wasn't obvious enough. Just wanted to point out the need for accuracy in a humorous way, as it's very easy to lead someone less well-versed in the wrong direction.

    Didn't/don't disagree with anything he, or you, said except for his implied "loads of power" increase being due to simply swapping out carb linkages, which, of course, it isn't, as you pointed out. Much of the power 'gain' achieved by the carb and linkage swap could have perhaps been achieved by simply analyzing his linkage problem and fixing it! That is the real difference between 'old-school' mechanics and 'new-wave' parts-swappers.

    Will he ultimately get more power and satisfaction out of his swap now that he's done it? . . . obviously! . . . he's starting out with a bigger carb! . . . not quite as good as it could be though without further carb tuning/re-jetting. That will require some 'old-school' trial-and-error. I digress . . .


    1960: '61 Rekord PII 1.7 3S 3.9 '69 Kadett LS 'sprint' 1.9 3A 3.18
    1970: '70 GT 1.9 4S 3.44 '72 GT 2.2SSD 5S 3.44 '72 GT 2.4FI 5S 3.44P
    1970: '73 GT 1.9FI 4S 3.44 '75 1900 1.9FI 4S 3.44
    1980: '85 Bitter SC 3.9FI 5S 3.44P
    2000: '09 Solstice GXP Coupe 2.0 SIDI VVT "Stage 2" Turbo 5S 3.73P


    "De inimico non tantum loquaris male, sed cogites."

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    Member My location West Coast GT's Avatar
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    You bring up a point that I'm dealing with unsuccessfully; tuning / re-jetting.
    My stock 1.9 with an eBay used Weber 32/36 was idling very rich. It's got the California emissions solenoid. I've squeezed down the idle circuit as much as I can. I’ve replaced everything that could produce a vacuum leak (of which there proved to be many). And I converted from water choke to electric.

    I’m to the point I think I need to re-jet. Having read the various threads / posts on this subject I can only conclude it’s a hit or miss operation.

    My 1.9 to 2.0 conversion, including OGTS’ “combo” cam, is nearing completion. Once the car is running and the engine broken in I’ll be addressing the rich idle problem. I’m hesitant to tackle it as part of the engine rebuild because I don’t like to introduce too many variables at once because a single variable often challenges my diagnostic talent. (Plus, I’m damn tired of cleaning & re-waxing the rear panel on the GT)

    My immediate thought is to pull the idle jet, and order the next two smaller sizes. If that works, I’ll then have a friend follow me on the freeway to determine if it’s running rich at speed. I don’t think it was because my temperature was running average. The car still got 30+ mpg. And because it didn’t over heat I figure it wasn’t too lean.

    Question: Does this approach appear sound?
    Last edited by tekenaar; 05-25-2010 at 06:03 PM. Reason: water chock

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    Owner of EZ2Wire.com My location GoinManta's Avatar
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    Don't forget to get shorter studs (I Can't remember the proper ones..) and replace them.. the Solex studs are far to long and make it hard to install and tighten the Weber.. I also like to get nylok nuts too to go with a split washer and thick washer.

    I think a 60mm stud that has even number of threads on each end and about 20mm in the middle with no threads is about what I use.

    Charles
    CURRENT
    '71 Opel Kadett 4 Door 36D (2.0 L w/ EFI & Auto) - "Mary Ann"
    '74 Opel Manta - "Barbara"
    '05 Pontiac GTO

    In the past owned:
    '06 Pontiac GTO
    2 Bitters (#491/#439)
    '73 Commodore GS
    ATLAS ( 74 Manta w/ 2.8L LK5 )
    '73 Blue Max Manta Luxus
    & at least 20 other Opels

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    Cunning Linguist Site Supporter My location tekenaar's Avatar
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    ExclamationA bit late, but . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by West Coast GT View Post
    You bring up a point that I'm dealing with unsuccessfully; tuning / re-jetting.
    My stock 1.9 with an eBay used Weber 32/36 was idling very rich. It's got the California emissions solenoid. I've squeezed down the idle circuit as much as I can. I’ve replaced everything that could produce a vacuum leak (of which there proved to be many). And I converted from water choke to electric.

    I’m to the point I think I need to re-jet. Having read the various threads / posts on this subject I can only conclude it’s a hit or miss operation.

    My 1.9 to 2.0 conversion, including OGTS’ “combo” cam, is nearing completion. Once the car is running and the engine broken in I’ll be addressing the rich idle problem. I’m hesitant to tackle it as part of the engine rebuild because I don’t like to introduce too many variables at once because a single variable often challenges my diagnostic talent. (Plus, I’m damn tired of cleaning & re-waxing the rear panel on the GT)

    My immediate thought is to pull the idle jet, and order the next two smaller sizes. If that works, I’ll then have a friend follow me on the freeway to determine if it’s running rich at speed. I don’t think it was because my temperature was running average. The car still got 30+ mpg. And because it didn’t over heat I figure it wasn’t too lean.

    Question: Does this approach appear sound?
    In a word, yes! . . . but let's look at this a bit further. The "California emissions (ICO) solenoid" in the primary idle/transition circuit has a fixed (can't be changed) #60 jet. This, in and of itself, cannot be the sole cause of your carb running "very rich", as you stated.

    So, based on your further statement, "I've squeezed down the idle circuit as much as I can"? . . . the first thing I would then ask is if this ICO (Idle Cut-Off) solenoid is connected to a switched 12V (only on with the ignition switch on) source? If not connected or non-functional (doesn't click when you apply 12V to its terminal), you have to severely mal-adjust the primary idle circuit "very rich" just to keep the engine running!



    The whole idea of that ICO solenoid is to cut off the primary idle circuit fuel flow COMPLETELY when 12V power is removed . . . for this reason, this device is sometimes also called an "anti-dieseling" solenoid! The only way to change the primary idle jet is to buy both a jet and a correct "standard" jet holder. Whichever vendor you deal with must be told that your carb has a larger size primary than secondary idle jet, so that the replacement fits your carb. Older/non-smog carbs had primary and secondary idle jets and holders of the same size! HTH
    Last edited by tekenaar; 05-27-2010 at 01:31 AM.


    1960: '61 Rekord PII 1.7 3S 3.9 '69 Kadett LS 'sprint' 1.9 3A 3.18
    1970: '70 GT 1.9 4S 3.44 '72 GT 2.2SSD 5S 3.44 '72 GT 2.4FI 5S 3.44P
    1970: '73 GT 1.9FI 4S 3.44 '75 1900 1.9FI 4S 3.44
    1980: '85 Bitter SC 3.9FI 5S 3.44P
    2000: '09 Solstice GXP Coupe 2.0 SIDI VVT "Stage 2" Turbo 5S 3.73P


    "De inimico non tantum loquaris male, sed cogites."

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    Member My location West Coast GT's Avatar
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    You nailed it.
    Because the carb is off the car due to the engine rebuild, I pulled it out of the parts bin and applied 12 volts DC to the connection. No solenoid sound or feel. It’s a dead stick.

    I’m guessing my 1st step is to purchase a new one and assess the change. I’ll probably order one through that Weber guy (on this forum) up in Vancouver.

    Thanks

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    70wagon 70wagon's Avatar
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    weber/solex

    thanks for comments questions and suggestions. I am new to working on Opels, have been an Oldsmobile man. I am a backyard mechanic. I have no training or school of auto repair, just an average guy wanting simplicity. Opels are simple, yet getting parts today in a small town in Alabama is tough, I can only imagine how tough it will be in another 20 years. If I put a newer carb that is common on my car I feel safe that in the future I can keep my car going. I wrestled with the Solex a few times and got it running pretty good but the idle would never come down. I wanted to get to a system I was used to working with, the weber is as easy as the edelbrocks I have used for years.

    Questions/answered. I did not change studs to bolt the weber on, I added 2 washers before the nuts, this took up the space of no threads on the bolts. I had troubles also getting mixture rich/ lean in order on my first install. That is when I pulled it off and made a thicker gasket. Once I did this idle and mixture was much more stable.Discovered issue when sprayed starter fluid around carb base. Linkages on mine were high school shop style welded together with extreme clumsy workings. I have no idea if this common to all Opels or just mine, either way I took it off. I now get all of the pedal not just part of it. I am so impressed with the engine now. It feels like a whole new beast compared to the lamb it was before.
    In short, some guys may know all the ins and outs of carbs the jets etc, I dont and not everyone else that visits this forum looking for advice will either. For guys like me, weber, bolt on and get with it. Either way, I love my Opel just the way it is. I am grateful to the friend that gave it to me after it sitting garaged for 12 years plus. First show in less than 2 weeks, wish me luck. All Euro show Huntsville Alabama June 5th Dublin Park, come join me.,,,
    Dave

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    Member My location West Coast GT's Avatar
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    It's good to hear that another Opel has been re-introduced to the road. They are cool little cars and I trust you'll come to admire them as much as most of us do.

    There are several places to get vintage Opel parts, both new and used. For new parts, I go to Opel GT Source in Sonora California. They ship world-wide and its one-stop shopping for most of your needs. There's another one, Opels USA is Southern California. I have never bought from this other source and have no experience; good or bad.

    I like your idea of converting to a cable throttle and have considered it for years. Once the mechanical linkage is adjusted correctly and worn grommets replaced, it functions fairly well. But too much slop introduces slow response and only partial opening of the secondary barrel.

    There’s a wide array of people on this site. We've got professional mechanics, machinists, racers, backyard mechanics and shade tree mechanics (like me), and folks who just plain drive their cars. We’ve got the purists who like their Opel to remain true, those of us who don’t feel the need for complete authenticity, and those into extreme modification. There are two things most of us share:
    • Appreciation of Opels
    • Disapproval of an abandoned project wasting another otherwise good Opel

    Hope to see more ideas from you,
    West Coast GT

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    70wagon 70wagon's Avatar
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    Thanks West Coast GT,,

    Thanks West Coast GT,,
    Thanks for your positive input, comments and suggestions. I have used Opel Gt Source before, and I am currently waiting on trans seals from them now. I love this forum board and I am very impressed to see so many users. This post on Weber/Solex was only my 2nd post and I didnt feel like it was 100% welcomed. I realize there are the die hard enthusiasts here, and people that were just as lost as me when I first got my Opel a year ago. I can tell you #'s of parts for 64 or 65 cutlass' and even though they are GM with lots of chevy parts interchanging I still have trouble getting parts at times. So when I started working on The Opel my first thought was to simplify, modernize, and not expect to have a hot rod but I am blown away now seeing this little wagon jump off the line like a rabbit. I know I will have this car till I die. I cant wait to take it on vacations, and car shows. I will keep the exterior as pure original as possible, the interior may get a radio someday, other than the mods to carb/linkage it will also stay orig under the hood.
    Dave

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    Tennessean Site Supporter My location hrcollinsjr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tekenaar View Post
    Hmmm . . . my reply was merely meant as 'tongue-in-cheek', nothing more, guess that wasn't obvious enough. Just wanted to point out the need for accuracy in a humorous way, as it's very easy to lead someone less well-versed in the wrong direction.
    Not to a newbie, anyway. Let him get a few more posts in at least.

    Harold

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    70wagon 70wagon's Avatar
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    temp 048.jpg
    temp 049.jpg

    many of you have inquired about the cable system I used. I used the original pedal system. The cable has a ball end. I put ball end as you can see in pic above. I added a support bar(black) that is used to keep tension on the cable. At the carb side my cable has 90 degree angle (design I dont like that was on previous vehicle) I took the cable and set it through a 2nd support bracket that I made (silver with holes) that is bolted to the carb using left rear stud. If you notice I used 2 washers to bolt carb down. This prevented me from changing studs. In my situation I used a thicker gasket also because of vaccum leak issues trying to use very thin factory thin gasket.
    There are many ways to do the same thing, and I am sure there are some that can tell you the RIGHT way to do it. This is a simple way that worked for me. Its not clean, cute or original. But, it got the job done. Good luck,,
    Dave

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    Tennessean Site Supporter My location hrcollinsjr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 70wagon View Post
    There are many ways to do the same thing, and I am sure there are some that can tell you the RIGHT way to do it. This is a simple way that worked for me. Its not clean, cute or original. But, it got the job done. Good luck,, Dave
    Appears functional, return spring mounting would be better in a straight line but does it really matter, probably not. Choke cable rubbing on the linkage I would look at though and as soon as I settled on the manual choke set up, I'd nip off the extra sticking out.

    Hazel Green, huh? Just a few miles north and you could have been a Tennessean.

    Welcome to the site. Reread all of your posts in this thread, hope to meet you at the show in Madison.

    Harold

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    101st Airborne 1/327 Inf Site Supporter My location MICAH1's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Dave,
    I like what you have done. However I have a GT and the entire system is linkage. Was talking to another site member earlier last week about a cable system, and have done some research on the web search engines for a conversion for GT's. I have a 240 series Volvo that has the cable system so I hope to use that design as a starting point. Thanks for your post and pictures. Please keep ALL of us informed of your mods and show results with your old/new wheels.
    Thomas

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    New/Old Owner 1973 GT My location JimVonBaden's Avatar
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    Thomas,

    There were a number of cable conversions at Carlisle. I will see if I can find any decent photos of them. Most were for FI conversions though.

    Jim

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    Have Opel, Will Travel oldopelguy's Avatar
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    If you want cable linkage easy then swap in a Manta manifold with the cable bracket on it and get a long enough cable to go from there to the auto trans kick-down cable mount. Nothing to fabricate, just bolting in parts.
    Lots of Opels, for a long time.

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    Cunning Linguist Site Supporter My location tekenaar's Avatar
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    QuestionHmmm . . . quick question?

    Quote Originally Posted by West Coast GT View Post
    You nailed it.
    Because the carb is off the car due to the engine rebuild, I pulled it out of the parts bin and applied 12 volts DC to the connection. No solenoid sound or feel. It’s a dead stick.

    I’m guessing my 1st step is to purchase a new one and assess the change. I’ll probably order one through that Weber guy (on this forum) up in Vancouver.

    Thanks
    . . . before you buy anything, when you ". . . applied 12 volts DC to the connection . . .", you did remember to "ground" the body of the carb, right?


    1960: '61 Rekord PII 1.7 3S 3.9 '69 Kadett LS 'sprint' 1.9 3A 3.18
    1970: '70 GT 1.9 4S 3.44 '72 GT 2.2SSD 5S 3.44 '72 GT 2.4FI 5S 3.44P
    1970: '73 GT 1.9FI 4S 3.44 '75 1900 1.9FI 4S 3.44
    1980: '85 Bitter SC 3.9FI 5S 3.44P
    2000: '09 Solstice GXP Coupe 2.0 SIDI VVT "Stage 2" Turbo 5S 3.73P


    "De inimico non tantum loquaris male, sed cogites."

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    Member My location West Coast GT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tekenaar View Post
    . . . before you buy anything, when you ". . . applied 12 volts DC to the connection . . .", you did remember to "ground" the body of the carb, right?
    Yep; I removed and grounded the solenoid itself.

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    101st Airborne 1/327 Inf Site Supporter My location MICAH1's Avatar
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    In Search of a Better Solution

    Quote Originally Posted by oldopelguy View Post
    If you want cable linkage easy then swap in a Manta manifold with the cable bracket on it and get a long enough cable to go from there to the auto trans kick-down cable mount. Nothing to fabricate, just bolting in parts.

    OldOpelGuy,
    I do plan to use the mounting point(s) on my intake manifold, and make some pedal changes that I will display when my part comes in next week. There is a bit of linkage binding behind the motor from the firewall insulation. I just want to get a full range of throttle.
    Thomas

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