Ford Taurus SHO Engine in Manta (was...rear? strength....)

[blackonblack89]

How strong is the manta's rear. I am gonna guess pretty weak since it was only design for the little 4 banger. But is there any HP/Tq numbers where it starts to fail. The current engine will make about 220/200 hp/tq at the crank. I am picking up the new motor/tranny to go into the car this weekend. I have no idea wat to do about the rear but first I have to figure out how to get this monster engine in. Anyways I was just thinking about the rear and am getting a little worried about. I did see on website in europe called mantamagic.com wear the guy put in a rover rear end pretty easily. I am going to have to defininaly look into this as that V8 makes alot more Tq than this six will. (for now)

[heimue]

Its always a question of how much hp/torque you put on the wheels how fast, how often. Anything northbound of around 180 hp can seriously damage your rear end, but if you have "only" 150 hp but use it on every red light then you better start searching for a new rear after less than a year.
Im working on my Kadett with around 170-180 hp, and bought a Kadett C with 180 hp + NOS (~230...240hp) which has essentially the same rear axle. Give it a break, to save it from breaking!

Dieter

[blackonblack89]

Originally Posted by heimue Its always a question of how much hp/torque you put on the wheels how fast, how often. Anything northbound of around 180 hp can seriously damage your rear end, but if you have "only" 150 hp but use it on every red light then you better start searching for a new rear after less than a year. Im working on my Kadett with around 170-180 hp, and bought a Kadett C with 180 hp + NOS (~230...240hp) which has essentially the same rear axle. Give it a break, to save it from breaking! Dieter

So basically baby it. Gotcha, I was thinking that as a temporary option.

[jerseydave]

I must have missed it, what engine are you going to put in?

[jeff denton]

I think if you were to enter key words "camaro saginaw" in the search you'll find the answer to your next question.

[blackonblack89]

Originally Posted by jerseydave I must have missed it, what engine are you going to put in?

A ford taurus SHO engine. My favorite engine. One of the most underated engines ever made. Plus the name fits perfect. The project name is Project "SHOpel". When u bleed SHO and like the opel manta. Only one thing can come of it. This one is a 3.0L(stock) and my only mods to the engine were the ones to make it North/south(which is really hard/rarley done) It has a t5 tranny bolted to it.

Plus they make great power NA and have a great power curve. Only plans for the engine is a simple 75 shot of giggle gas which will put me at almost 300whp. but thats later


here my SHO. It's an 89 and is the black one. Lots of mods with a vortech supercharger getting put on now. 400whp here I come
http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...after%20paint/

[wrench459]

The fuel management how are you going to handle that one?
They(FORD) killed the power to help the trannsmision live on the shift points.

[blackonblack89]

Originally Posted by wrench459 The fuel management how are you going to handle that one? They kill the power to help the trannsmision live on the shift points.

Actually i am not sure yet about fuel managent and some of the other stuff(tuning, electonics, speedo,tach,ect. I hope to use the SHO stuff as much as possilbe to keep it cheap and simple. cooling is going to a problem b/c of the radiotor support. And I am sure their will be plenty of others problems. But I can not solve them until I get the engine in. IF it fits.......

The SHO engine as far as I know(pretty sure) did not kill power when it (I) shift. definaly not the 5-speed SHO's maybe the 93-95 auto's but they are crap and I stay away from auto's.

[wrench459]

HUMM the modern car if equipment with a air bag
has a flight recoder..
It knows when your foot is on the brake or not.
The ECM knowns what the tps is ,the map or the maf sensor is reading.
Its called a snapshot of the fault at the moment.
nope they dont know what gear your in. LOL
Just ask your insurance agent

[blackonblack89]

Originally Posted by wrench459 HUMM the modern car if equipment with a air bag has a flight recoder.. It knows when your foot is on the brake or not. The ECM knowns what the tps is ,the map or the maf sensor is reading. Its called a snapshot of the fault at the moment. nope they dont know what gear your in. LOL

What are u trying to get at?


I know the computer know the TPS position and MAF reading but I do not think it cuts any power. but I do not know 100%.

Actually 89 did not come with airbags

[wrench459]

check out the download section ie EEC-IV
I believe it was called a BOO sensor back then brake on and off
Simple switch

[opelwasp]

How are you going to get the engine to fit into the car? The SHO engine is huge on the top end. The dual over head cam heads are huge and might not fit.

[blackonblack89]

Originally Posted by opelwasp How are you going to get the engine to fit into the car? The SHO engine is huge on the top end. The dual over head cam heads are huge and might not fit.

Thats my biggest conern now. I really hope it fits. another problem I foresee is the height of this engine. The SHO engine is also a really tall engine b/c of the huge intake plenum. My only answer to this is cutting a whole in the hood or running no hood lol we will see soon enough.


Actually i think their might will be lots of problem with fitment. exaust manifold are going to be CLOSE. The raditor support on the manta is really small and I need to make room for a bigger raditor. but there's only one way to find out..........

[opelwasp]

You will also need to see how you are going to fit it between the engine bay and the wheel wells. That motor is super wide. Have you thought of how you are going to reroute the exhaust?

[blackonblack89]

guess an update is due.

Got the motor/tranny out today. went smoothly for the most part. To my surprise it was only one thing stripped out and I thought the rust was goint be bad. but it wasnt.

Anywho got some rough measurment in and it going to be tight fit(duh) lol. The height is higher than the hood but thats a later problem. Main probelm I thought was going to be width but it may not be as bad as I thoght. Luckly the SHO block is small but as mentioned the SHO engine is all heads/intake. But the opel engine bay actually get wider as u go up so the heads and intake may actually fit width wise (measuring it). We will see.

The oil pan and cross memeber may be the biggest problem. This may decide if it works or not But its all fun and so far a learning expirence. First time I pulled an engine out of a RWD car. SO much easier than the SHO or FWD. I just hope it will work. Still lots of work to do. Minor rust on the unibody under battery tray, jack points, ect. Engine had to come out anyways.

[blackonblack89]

Well last sunday we took the engine/tranny out of the opel. It was actually alot eaiser than I thought it was going to be. Almost 40 years old and only i bolt stipped!!! That made things easier had the engine out in 4 hours with a lunch break.
Couple pics from that
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...03-08_1803.jpg
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...03-08_1804.jpg

Well anywho I picked up an RWD SHO engine/tranny combo and today we separted it. And then did a VERY rough test fitment of the engine. It is super tight and never got it fully down where I wanted. The cross member and the oil pan is a known problem hence the dry sump thread. Still looking into that myself. But the width of the engine is close but will make it. Height is still a problem though.

Here some pics of the day.
First getting it in. moving some stuff out of the way.
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...8/DSC_0004.jpg
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...8/DSC_0013.jpg
Actually the engine has to sit alot closer to the firewall. The old heater box is going out and then the trans tunnel has to be modifed along with tons of other stuff.
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...8/DSC_0005.jpg

custom hugger headers needed
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...8/DSC_0020.jpg

reason why a custom oil pan is needed or dry sump setup.
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...8/DSC_0016.jpg

Thats all. Hopefully it will fit. I don't know though. Alot of work will be needed. Right now I am being optimistic but its hard when it's so close.

[valkyrie067]

From what I remember when I worked for ford they only cut back power during shifts on the autos because yes there weak. I rebuilt alot of them.

As far as a black box they can pull info from the pcm but the one they really go to for info, on fords, is the abs module. And the only time they really look at them is when there is a death in the crash or your trying to sue the motor co.

I also thought about using SHOpel, but then I thought what it would look like on a tag. I figured most nonopel people would see it as SHOPel. I figure I will go with either GT SHO, OPELSHO or SHO GT, still under debate.