swap 1.9 for a 2.2

[jayhawkjesse33]

Thanks for the info. I am using the stock 2.2 head and have already ordered an adapter for the intake (and also one for the thermostat) to use my Weber carb that I have on my 1.9 now. OGTS was very helpful and knowledgable about what I would need to make this swap happen. Guess I won't be adding a cam onto that order...

[Viny Charb]

Quick question....Has anyone ever run a 4 speed with a 2.2L as a daily driver???And managed NOT to blow it up????

[gvy]

Hi,

The cih2.2i is originally build in the opel rekord. ( a family car by the way)
In that car you could choose to buy it with a getrag240 5 speed , a 4 speed or an automatic transmission.

The ratios of the four speed of the rekord are not the same as the ratios of the GT.
The rekord is a heavier car than the GT.

In my opinion, you can drive the 2.2i with the original GT 4 speed without major problems
I prefer my Getrag240 5sp because, with the higher torque of the 2.2 you can use the full potention of the overdrive ratio of the getrag 5speed for highway cruising on lower revs

The only thing I would do is use the bigger clutch that is used in the rekord 2.2i instead of the original in the GT.
I ones broke my pressure plate and along with that a lot more......

ratio's
................rekord2.2i 4sp.....rekord2.2igetrag 5sp......GT1.9 4sp
1st............3,640................3,717......... .................3,428
2nd...........2,120................2,019............ ..............2,156
3rd............1,336................1,316........... ...............1,366
4th............1,000................1,000............ ..............1,000
5th....................................0,804
reverse.......3,522................3,445.......... ................3,317

rear diff.......3,27.................3,45.............. ..............3,44

greetings
Geert

[opelspyder]

I would suggest if you are thinking of running a Weber 32/36, that you upgrade to the Weber 38/38. I nthink you would be cutting out a lot of potential of that engine by running too small of a carb. You need the bigger air flow in, to get it out
Keith

[jayhawkjesse33]

Again, thanks for the info. I don't have the 4speed transmission in my car...its the automatic, which is actually a 3 speed auto. So, hopefully someone out there gained something from your info on gear ratios, it just doesn't apply to my situation.

I wondered about the carb as well, but wasn't sure if the switch would make much of a difference. Which type or 38 would be best? What advantages does it have over the 32/36? What disadvantages does it pose opposed to the 32/36?

[jayhawkjesse33]

Does anyone have a 2.2 with an auto set-up? The reason I ask is because of deciding which carb to go with...I have a 32/36 but am contemplating a 38. Thoughts or opinions are welcome and appreciated

[neuropel]

I suspect you could jet a 32/36 to work well for the 2.2, but what about that 1.9 intake? Some of our experts can/will chime in I'm sure, but my understanding is that the 2.2 head flows pretty nice and the 1.9 intake might be overly restrictive unless you modify it some. And, if you were to modify the intake some to allow better flow, you'd be better off with a 38/38. Much of it will depend on how restrictive your intake is going to be. I'm building a 2.2 at the moment (2.2 crank and 2.2 custom pistons), but I'll be using a ported 1.9 "big valve" head with a fairly mild cam and even with that I'm planning to use a 38/38. Having the larger displacement and better flowing head won't do you nearly as much good if the intake is the bottle neck. Since you're going to the trouble and cost of an engine swap, it's good that you're taking the time to research and get the optimal performance for your dollars and effort, but think about it...a cam isn't going to incur that much more expense on top of what you've already spent, nor is a good intake/carb combo. Have you considered exhaust? Also, have you upgraded your brakes? Those are higher ticket items you have to consider now as well. You'll really enjoy the performance difference and it will be money well spent.

[RallyBob]

Originally Posted by jayhawkjesse33 Does anyone have a 2.2 with an auto set-up? The reason I ask is because of deciding which carb to go with...I have a 32/36 but am contemplating a 38. Thoughts or opinions are welcome and appreciated

Not yet, but I'm working on putting one together. I've got a stock 2.2 shortblock, a slightly milled 1.9H head with 2.0 litre valves, mild hydraulic camshaft, heavily ported intake, and a heavily modified 32/36 Weber (bored out secondary venturi), recurved distributor, Compufire ignition, Sprint manifold and 2" custom exhaust, 3000 rpm high stall torque converter, 10" x 12" external tranny cooler, synthetic racing ATF. Nothing crazy, just a mello cruiser for my Ascona wagon.

I have a few 38 DGAS's I could choose from, but I want the economy of the 32/36 around town.

Bob

[GTJIM]

I suspect that with an auto the progressive 32/36 (that you already have!) will give better around town drivability that the more performance orientated 38/38 which whacks both barrels open at once. With a properly ported 1.9L intake you should get good low end torque and mid-range power. The Top rev range horsepower may be slightly less - but, face it, with an auto trans most of your cruising will be in the lower rev ranges.

A future improvement would be to consider Fuel Injection which works very well with an auto trans.

[BQS4]

Originally Posted by jayhawkjesse33 Does anyone have a 2.2 with an auto set-up? The reason I ask is because of deciding which carb to go with...I have a 32/36 but am contemplating a 38. Thoughts or opinions are welcome and appreciated

There's one here in GA, PM "Mark R Hayes" (that's his screen name)on the website here. John, Mark, Scott, and I worked on Mark's 2.2 w/auto and 38 weber over the weekend.

[guyopel]

I drove Mark's car after we completed repairs and it was working great . If you want performance the 38 weber is a good way to go if you are looking for fuel mileage and are just doing " City / stop-n-go driving " you may want a 32/36 weber .

[jayhawkjesse33]

I do most of my driving around the city, running errands, joy riding, etc. However I do take it to Indianapolis quite a bit, which is about an hour away from me and is straight interstate driving....but its not like I'm planning on doing any racing with this car. Sounds like keeping the 32/36 is a good choice then? At least thats what I'm picking up from what I'm hearing. I was just curious because I am definitely going to need a rebuild on my carb now (running very rich and having some fuel pooling in the bottom), so I was between rebuilding or buying a new (different) carb.

I am going to start engine tear down sometime this week since its 94 here today with a heat index of 104 and I really dont feel like sweating profusely while driving. The plan is to have the engine swapped out the weekend of July 11th and I'm hoping to get some of the parts off now and have them cleaned up and either polished, polished then powercoated clear or just a straight powdercoating. If I'm gonna do this, I'd prefer to do it "right" and make it look as good as I'm hoping it will run...

[thescifiguy]

Why bother upgrading to a bigger engine and then use a dinky carb? I couldn't believe the difference between my 2.0L auto with a 32/36 and it's present 38. The difference is especially noticable at highway speeds. You've got all sorts of airflow improvements with your headers and intake manifold and your new engine has a 15%+ increase in it's demand for air. Makes sense to me that a carb with an additional approximately 5% of air flow is the least you should do. Plus you've got that fancy high stall torque converter(I'm soooo jealous!), which tells me you like to spin the tires once in a while. It's still a 4 cylinder and it sounds like you have a pretty fuel efficient setup, so I can't imagine that a properly jetted 38 wouldn't have darn close to the same economy as a 32/36. You're gonna have to rejet the 32/36 anyway.

I vote that you go for the bigger carb

[jayhawkjesse33]

You must have me confused for RallyBob's set up...I don't have that fancy high stall torque converter or the modified intake and exhaust manifolds.

Mine is going to be pretty stock everything, with the exception of a few necessary upgrades. But the carb has definitely been a question mark for me...and the question has definitely gotten mixed responses. And as far as any rejetting goes...well, thats gonna be a major learning experience for me because I have never done it before nor do I know how to do it.

[thescifiguy]

Ooops, looks like I did confuse your setup with RallyBob's.

I just did jetting for the first time a few weeks ago myself. There are many threads on this website on the subject, including mine:
"Jetting a Weber 38 on a 2.0/2.2".
As everyone will tell you, all engines are different and it's a trial and error process, but, hopefully, someone will come forward who has a similar setup and they'll list the size jets they're using. It's real easy to put them in, all you need is a screw driver and in a couple of minutes you could change them all.
You could start a thread asking if anyone has a 2.2 with a weber 32/36 or a 38 or whatever. OGTS can send you an assortment of jets in the range you need. Keep in mind that a minute tweak of the distributor timing can make a huge difference in the engine's performance(see my thread).

[jayhawkjesse33]

So I was just at one of my local O'Reilly auto parts stores and I had some great luck with a few parts. They have NEW starters and NEW water pumps for our Opels! And for (i hate to say it) cheaper than OGTS. I got the starter for 55 bucks (+ a possible $27 core charge) and the water pump for 35 (with a possible $2 core charge). I will have those parts by Friday...

I've also found a local guy to do some powdercoating for me, at a great price. He does this with his brother as a 2nd form of income and just enjoys doing it. A body shop referred me to him, they send a lot of their work there. As of right now, I'm planning on getting the valve cover, the intake manifold, the thermostat and the water pump done. Any other suggestions?

[jayhawkjesse33]

Just got done un-crating the 2.2 and all the goodies that came along with it. I am finishing up some stuff tonight on the car to get it all ready for the swap on Saturday. I still have 3 bolts in the intake to exhaust that I can't get loose yet...any suggestions? Other than that I'm ready to roll and couldn't be more excited...

[BQS4]

Originally Posted by jayhawkjesse33 I still have 3 bolts in the intake to exhaust that I can't get loose yet...any suggestions?

If you're referring to the ones that hold the carb'ed intake to the exhaust manifold, I'd just drill the heads off and be done...

[jayhawkjesse33]

Yep, those are the ones I'm talking about...they are a pain. Do you have to use the same bolts (countersunk torque bolts) when replacing them?

[BQS4]

Originally Posted by jayhawkjesse33 Yep, those are the ones I'm talking about...they are a pain. Do you have to use the same bolts (countersunk torque bolts) when replacing them?

No, you can us allen head or socket cap screws, or you can open up the recess they go into with a dremel tool and use a hex head screw.

[GTJIM]

If you drill the heads off those stuck screws at least you will be left with something sticking up out of the exhaust manifold that you can get hold of after treating the stuck threads to PB Blaster and HEAT.

If you keep trying to undo them they may shear off flush with the exhaust manifold - then getting the threaded bit out is a whole 'nother game!

They are standard 8mm X 1.25mm thread pitch so you can get Metric Allen Head cap screws that will replace them (from McMaster-Carr). Use the stronger allen head cap screws with some Nickel anti-seize on the threads when you replace them and the next time they are up for removal you could have a 'fighting chance'.

Did the 2.2 come with an exhaust manifold? If so use that one as it is a later model 'Sprint' fuel injection type with nowhere for the intake to bolt onto = thus eliminating the problem in the future.

[jayhawkjesse33]

So we got the engine swapped out on Saturday and got it running late that night. We changed out the motor mounts, the engine, new water pump, new starter, new torque tube donut, installed an electric fuel pump, ran all new hoses and probably a few other things that are slipping my mind. Worked on fine tuning it yesterday and went out for the first drive to see how it felt. It just feels mean compared to what I used to drive!! However, the transmission is now acting up. I have an automatic, and it doesn't want to shift out of first gear...when it feels like it should shift in to 2nd, the engine just revs real high and it doesn't go anywhere. If I start out from a stop, I can manually put it in low gear and give it gas then shift it manually in to 2nd when it feels like it should and it works fine. 3rd gear however still feels like its slipping a bit. And when its in 3rd gear and I punch it, it will just rev high rpms but not downshift. Pretty frustrating seeing how I wasn't having this problem before....

Also, seems I have a small leak around the fuel pump...in the fitting of the pre-filter and the pump itself, so that needs addressing today.

And then when I did take it out last night to get gas, I started hearing a rattling from under the car...the brace/bracket for the muffler is gone so its flopping around. Then on the way home it sounded even worse, and when i got in the garage, I looked under the rear of the car and rubber rings that hold my tailpipes are gone as well. Now with that said, I was planning on having the exhaust redone this week anyway....but still a bit odd, but probably impressive on the cars behalf of shaking the stuff loose due to the new life it has.

It was a long, long weekend and still have some stuff to get fixed....

[GTJIM]

First - if you keep driving with a slipping auto the guts will burn out of it.

1) Check the fluid level - low or high with result in low oil pressure.
2) Check that the vacuum modulator is working and there are no leaks in vac line.
3) Make sure the kick-down cable is correctly adjusted - this adjustment has a major effect upon internal pressures and can destroy a trans if wrong.
4) What sort of condition (milage) has your trans got? Old and worn won't hack it with the extra torque the 2.2 motor puts out.

Probably a good idea to find a local GM Turbo-hydro trans man - an 'old' one who knows stuff!
You might even find someone at the local Suzuki shop who knows TH180 autos as they used that trans right up into the 1990's.
HTH

[opelenvy]

I agree with Jim on the vacuum lines. I'm not an automatic guy, but in Germany last year at the meet I rode with someone who had an auto and it would not shift out of first. If done manually we could get it to second but never third. After getting back to the park it was investigated and it was the vacuum line on the trans, it had come off. Took it out for a drive and all was well.

[jayhawkjesse33]

So I just thought I'd provide an update to what's goin on with the 2.2. The motor is fantastic, but the car as a whole is having a few issues.

1.) The transmission. I have an automatic and it is slipping like crazy! If I give it any gas at all it revs really high in 1st gear and doesn't wanna go in to 2nd. I can bump it from 1st to 2nd manually, however 3rd gear just doesn't feel right...especially if I give it any gas at all. I took it to a transmission shop yesterday and they gave me the "we drove it and somethings not right. We can do an overhaul for you. Cost ya about 12-1400 bucks". Needless to say I left without any plans. I actually had the car at an exhaust shop today to have the exhaust overhauled and had the guy check out the vacuum lines....and all was good. He said he couldn't see the kickdown cable attached anywhere though.

2.) The hood. Which I know is a weird one to mention. But ever since I changed the motor (along with the new motor mounts) the hood will rattle at idle. When I'm goin down the road, it doesn't do it. I have had to put a new catch-bar on the right side of the hood because its came off at some point, so that could be contributing to the rattling, but its annoying.

3.) The alternator. This is currently being covered in another thread (see 'smoke and sparks from alternator'). But I don't have any charging going on and my amp gauge is in the negative and the light is always on. I did have a wire meltdown (fuseable links at the red wire from alternator to the fuse panel, the wire from the solenoid to the fuse panel and from the voltage regulator to the blue and white wire going to the fuse panel) due to a short in the alternator. Not sure what my problem is...

I did have the exhaust done today....2 1/4" pipe back to a turbo muffler with 2 outlets with 2 inch pipes over the exhaust to chrome tips out the back. Much different sound than what I'm used to, but its a good, rich sound and really sounds great when I give it some gas (as little as that can be right now with the trans issue)

Once I finally get these things taken care of, I think I'm really gonna love driving my car even more than I already did...which was a helluva lot to begin with