gr diver electric FP needs

[West Coast GT]

In my opinion, adding the fuel pump does not eliminate the need to crank the engine, rather, it reduces the long cranking sequence necessary to re-fill the carb bowl. However, it does not stop the fuel evaporation problem.

You will need to add a fuel pump switch, but I've found there is the added benefit that a discreet switch adds one more layer of security against car thief.

[gr_diver]

tekenaar: thank you for the explanation. It now makes sense...

West Coast GT: This is why I want to add an electric pump. If coupled with a inertia switch, but not coupled by oil pressure, it will start pumping the moment the ignition comes "live". Like in modern cars, that you turn the switch to the run position, wait until some of the dash lights go off, in the meanwhile the fuel pump has stopped running, and then you proceed with cranking.

Now that I think about it, I might add an electric pump up front, with it's hoses bypassing the mechanical pump. It could be operated by a switch from the dash. You turn the ignition on, press the pump button for a couple of seconds, then let go the button and crank. It would only need a tiny pump to just fill the bowl... Maybe one for a motorcycle application?... My cousin is a "Triumph" freak, and works at a dealership. I will give him a call... Maybe they have low pressure pumps, for older carburetor configurations...

[West Coast GT]

I use an electric fuel pump rated at 25 gph @ 4.5 psi. This did not require my having to add a return line to the tank. These pumps are common and available at most generic auto parts stores. Summit Racing and JC Whitney offer these pumps on-line, and through their respective catalogs.

Also, I purchased a fuel pump blank from Opel GT Source and removed the mechanical fuel pump. Otherwise, the mechanical pump's diaphragm eventually breaks and all of the engine oil drains out.

I installed an independent fuel pump switch, connected to a constantly live positive fuse. This allows me to fill the carb bowl before energising the starter.

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by West Coast GT I use an electric fuel pump rated at 25 gph @ 4.5 psi. This did not require my having to add a return line to the tank. These pumps are common and available at most generic auto parts stores. Summit Racing and JC Whitney offer these pumps on-line, and through their respective catalogs. Also, I purchased a fuel pump blank from Opel GT Source and removed the mechanical fuel pump. Otherwise, the mechanical pump's diaphragm eventually breaks and all of the engine oil drains out. I installed an independent fuel pump switch, connected to a constantly live positive fuse. This allows me to fill the carb bowl before energising the starter.

. . . kind of dangerous . . . means pump can be run regardless of ignition key position! Suggest changing to a "switched-12V" (comes on with ignition key "On") source instead, for safety reasons and allows the same function you stated, but only with key "On".

[West Coast GT]

Otto,
You're absolutely right. It's amazing I can even find my way home without breadcrumbs.

I've gone immediately out to the garage and that pump is now wired to a switched circuit.

I'm not a big fan of the mood icons, but this time I wish we had one of the village idiot gone missing (me). Thanks for pointing me down the right road.

[baronbors]

This is how I put mine in

[tomking]

The auto stores sell replacement shock switches like some manufacturers put in their autos. In the case of a crash it opens and must be reset in order for the fuel pump to work again. This is what I did with my electric fuel pump.

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by tomking The auto stores sell replacement shock switches like some manufacturers put in their autos. In the case of a crash it opens and must be reset in order for the fuel pump to work again. This is what I did with my electric fuel pump.

Always a good idea in case of an accident, only better along with an engine-OP EFP safety switch, such as:

[gr_diver]

I got into thinking that there is no reason to add an electric pump just for priming the carburetor. It is just not worth the money/effort. If I install one , it is going to be a complete replacement of the stock pump. So I will justify the cost, and decide if I will proceed or not...

Unfortunately, locally we do not have those "generic" automotive part shops like you guys fortunately have in the USA (napa etc.). There are only car-brand dealers, and a few small shops that do not stock fuel pumps, since they are considered "specific application" parts. Also, Opel didn't produce carb-equipped models with electric fuel pumps, so as to get that unit through a dealer. There is a BOSCH dealer though, that can get me pretty much anything available by the company, if I order it with a part number.

Has anybody found a Bosch fuel pump that can be used for carburetors? I have been searching the internet for articles concerning such conversions in other brand cars, but nothing usable (for me) came up... Only high pressure units. Even Bosch doesn't have a catalog for their own available fuel pumps!

[booeman]

Originally Posted by gr_diver I got into thinking that there is no reason to add an electric pump just for priming the carburetor. It is just not worth the money/effort. If I install one , it is going to be a complete replacement of the stock pump. So I will justify the cost, and decide if I will proceed or not... Unfortunately, locally we do not have those "generic" automotive part shops like you guys fortunately have in the USA (napa etc.). There are only car-brand dealers, and a few small shops that do not stock fuel pumps, since they are considered "specific application" parts. Also, Opel didn't produce carb-equipped models with electric fuel pumps, so as to get that unit through a dealer. There is a BOSCH dealer though, that can get me pretty much anything available by the company, if I order it with a part number. Has anybody found a Bosch fuel pump that can be used for carburetors? I have been searching the internet for articles concerning such conversions in other brand cars, but nothing usable (for me) came up... Only high pressure units. Even Bosch doesn't have a catalog for their own available fuel pumps!

I kind of like this idea,eBay Motors: New In Line Fuel Pump BMW Opel Alfa Romeo Fiat Renault (item 190123415465 end time Jun-24-07 18:08:43 PDT) for my manta it would fit where the stock fuel filter goes. (filter would have to be higher)

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by booeman I kind of like this idea,eBay Motors: New In Line Fuel Pump BMW Opel Alfa Romeo Fiat Renault (item 190123415465 end time Jun-24-07 18:08:43 PDT) for my manta it would fit where the stock fuel filter goes. (filter would have to be higher)

Yeah BUT! . . . that's an EFI pump, common one from early to late '80s . . .

[booeman]

Originally Posted by tekenaar Yeah BUT! . . . that's an EFI pump, common one from early to late '80s . . .

so 3 bar and 100/160 L/H would be excessive for dsd 40mm carbs? from what I've read I need 1.5 to 2.5 psi to keep the bowls full.

[gr_diver]

Then again 3 bar are equal to 43.5psi. Too much!!!

[Lindsay]

eBay Motors: 1973 OPEL OPEL GT Fuel Pump - Electric CARTER P60504 (item 110129849093 end time Jun-20-07 16:40:52 PDT)

eBay Motors: 1973 OPEL OPEL GT Fuel Pump CARTER P60504 (item 200112991218 end time Jun-23-07 07:13:09 PDT)

Carter Fuel Pump

This is the famous Carter electric fuel pump for carburetors. Not sure if Rock Auto or Auto Parts Giant ship overside USA. Need to check their web sites. Simple eBay search found it.

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by Lindsay eBay Motors: 1973 OPEL OPEL GT Fuel Pump - Electric CARTER P60504 (item 110129849093 end time Jun-20-07 16:40:52 PDT) eBay Motors: 1973 OPEL OPEL GT Fuel Pump CARTER P60504 (item 200112991218 end time Jun-23-07 07:13:09 PDT) Carter Fuel Pump This is the famous Carter electric fuel pump for carburetors. Not sure if Rock Auto or Auto Parts Giant ship overside USA. Need to check their web sites. Simple eBay search found it.

. . . and here it is as installed in my 2.2 SSD GT:

[booeman]

this clears up alot for me. Carter Fuel Pump thanks for the info everyone. Tony

[jmbinjax]

I used the same exact items as OTTO shows in the previous posts but located pump in a different location. It took three new pumps to get a good one as the first two were frozen and would not pump - they were new in sealed package. The second actually started working after I gave it a wack out of frustration. I didn't trust it so I exchanged it. Anyway, my question is this: I like the idea of the pump coming on when ignition is on to fill the bowl before I crank the engine but how do I accomplish this and still have the oil pressure switch for safety and not have a manual switch for the pump?

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by jmbinjax I used the same exact items as OTTO shows in the previous posts but located pump in a different location. . . . Anyway, my question is this: I like the idea of the pump coming on when ignition is on to fill the bowl before I crank the engine but how do I accomplish this and still have the oil pressure switch for safety and not have a manual switch for the pump?

That would be a great idea, unfortunately not possible with just the OP6610 safety switch installed as recommended in previous posts here. Not saying it can't be done, just not with what's installed! Hope you already know how to properly wire the OP6610 by using "Search", as I've already discussed this "ad nauseam" in several threads from ~2 years ago.

My '90 Acura with an EFI engine runs the e-pump for a few seconds to pressurize the EFI fuel rail as soon as the key is turned to the "On" position. I've not researched how this is done, but imagine it's done with some sort of "time-delay" relay. This feature could certainly be adapted here . . . HMMMMM!

[jeff denton]

Here's how I did it. My starter switch is a single pole, double throw, self centering toggle. Meaning it can do two functions, but it always stays in the middle, is spring loaded up and down. If you push the toggle up the engine cranks. If you pull the lever down, it bypasses the fuel pump relay and powers up the fuel pump, to prime the float bowl. It works just fine, we have no fuel problems on my car. Don't need them!

[namba209]

Originally Posted by tekenaar That would be a great idea, unfortunately not possible with just the OP6610 safety switch installed as recommended in previous posts here. Not saying it can't be done, just not with what's installed! Hope you already know how to properly wire the OP6610 by using "Search", as I've already discussed this "ad nauseam" in several threads from ~2 years ago. My '90 Acura with an EFI engine runs the e-pump for a few seconds to pressurize the EFI fuel rail as soon as the key is turned to the "On" position. I've not researched how this is done, but imagine it's done with some sort of "time-delay" relay. This feature could certainly be adapted here . . . HMMMMM!

I wanted to do something similar to the monza, but haven't researched it yet. But to save on the battery and starter, I crank the engine over until the oil lite goes out, then wait until the lite comes on again, and go through that drill until the engine starts. As long as the oill lite is off, the pump will run and fill the carb float bowl, until there is enuff fuel in it to start the engine. HTH.

[ddoyle]

Originally Posted by baronbors This is how I put mine in

Baronbors, looking at your picture, what is the device next to the fuel pump? With the white thing on the end. I was thinking inertia switch, but they are normally mounted up and down with the reset button on top. Am I looking at it wrong, or just seeing things?

Dan

[Lindsay]

Originally Posted by gr_diver All these thoughts came because, now that summer has arrived, I regularly have an empty fuel bowl due to heat soak. And since the heatshield/spacer combination is in place, and have covered the fuel line in plastic loom, I am trying more ways to further reduce the phenomenon. It is not vapor lock, since the engine starts say half an hour later. But a few hours later, the fuel is almost gone, and I have to keep cranking for a few seconds to fill it up again...

eBay Motors: One Way Fuel Flow Check Valve~Diesel/Gas~5/16" Line (item 250129339506 end time Jun-19-07 05:35:28 PDT)

eBay Motors: One way Check valve for Gas or Diesel fuel 5/16" Bio (item 170121540424 end time Jun-19-07 14:29:11 PDT)

5/16" (8 mm) fuel line check valve would prevent fuel from draining. If most of the gasoline is evaporating due to heat, check valve probably will NOT solve your issues.

[gr_diver]

Lindsay: indeed the fuel gets evaporated due to underhood temperatures after shutdown. So a check valve will not be of help.

Only an electric pump, operating when ignition is on, but before cranking, will help the condition.

E-bay is an ideal way for obtaining parts, but since I do not have any means for money credit transactions, I have to stick with what's available at the local market. Unfortunately so far nothing has come up. I might need to get to other brand dealers and ask for pumps that were used in carb applications. Too bad it is an exam period at my university and I do not have much spare time for such activities yet. I hope next week that I will finish for the summer, I will be able to search...

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by gr_diver Lindsay: indeed the fuel gets evaporated due to underhood temperatures after shutdown. So a check valve will not be of help. Only an electric pump, operating when ignition is on, but before cranking, will help the condition. E-bay is an ideal way for obtaining parts, . . . I hope next week that I will . . . be able to search...

Don't know why I didn't think of this before, but I used an e-pump from any early '80s ('81 actually) Honda Accord for years . . . those were still carb engines. Very reliable, internally regulated (demand pump) and correct pressure for carbs. Even used it in my SSD40 GT for a while . . .



Don't know when or if they started importing Hondas to Greece, but since you're limited to local supplies, you might check on '80s Hondas . . . they used the same engines in most models at the time.

[gr_diver]

Good one Otto! Thanks, I will check it out... Because your picture is a little small, is that pump the one in my second attachment?

About fuel pump installation, are there any reasons that advise against installing the fuel pump inside the luggage compartment, and not to the underside? In there, if I remove a protective cover that hides the tank, I have access to the fuel hose. To my surprise, my tank has a soldered nipple exit, and the hose it attached with a hose clamp! Nice! Anyway, I have access to about 25cm (10 in.) of hose before it exits towards the underside of the car. Plenty of room, and safe area to mount with self-tapping screws, since there are no lines on the underside there. Would you recommend this place for the installation?

I also like the fact, that because a relatively long part of the hose is accessible, I can also add a filter before the pump, and a small valve before the filter, to make filter changes easy...