Pontiac to be "Killed Off"!

[Ooooner]

Wow....

Check this out!

GM to pull the plug on Pontiac car brand - Apr. 24, 2009

[saxybiker]

Originally Posted by Ooooner Wow.... Check this out! GM to pull the plug on Pontiac car brand - Apr. 24, 2009

Well, if this is true, Looks like I will own another Opel/Orphan.
My 2008 Solistce!

Vickie

[newman27]

Nooooooooooooooooo! It appears I will own three orphans!

[tagger]

This is ridiculous...I've owned Pontiacs my entire life. Exceptional quality and performance. What would make someone want to kill this brand off??? You can't drive 5 minutes where I live without seeing a Grand Prix, Grand Am, or Bonneville. While I do own a 1972 Buick GS, I'd rather see the Buick name go than Pontiac. Young buyers have nothing new and affordable to look forward to...

[Aardvaark]

Originally Posted by tagger Young buyers have nothing new and affordable to look forward to...

Isn't reality that young people tend to buy imports or entry level American?
And Baby Boomers who buy domestic have pretty much made Buick the default car of the AARP croud. And we are the largest group with the where-with-all to buy these more expensive cars?

If it wasn't for BB'ers, Buick would most likely would have gone the way of the DooDoo bird.

It would seem that Pontiac has the same problem Oldsmobile had. A rapidly
shrinking buyer base. *Shruggs*

[krewzer]

Now's the time to snag one of those 6L GTO's

[RallyBob]

Originally Posted by Aardvaark Isn't reality that young people tend to buy imports or entry level American? And Baby Boomers who buy domestic have pretty much made Buick the default car of the AARP croud. And we are the largest group with the where-with-all to buy these more expensive cars? If it wasn't for BB'ers, Buick would most likely would have gone the way of the DooDoo bird. It would seem that Pontiac has the same problem Oldsmobile had. A rapidly shrinking buyer base. *Shruggs*

Reality is, Buick sells twice as many cars in China as the US. And that market is growing at an unbelievable rate even in this economy. I doubt they'd sever those ties knowing that fact.

[GTJIM]

You guys (and the whole Western World!) has been subjected to one of the greatest military defeats of all time - the virtual wiping out of the Western Financial System!

Now the wobbly Icons are being dealt with - being 'killed off' - along with our jobs.

Wake up and smell the camel dung - that is not the problem ... look at China!

[Aardvaark]

Originally Posted by RallyBob Reality is, Buick sells twice as many cars in China as the US. And that market is growing at an unbelievable rate even in this economy. I doubt they'd sever those ties knowing that fact.

Yup. I should have mentioned that too. I was thinking domestically why the brand wouldn't be killed in favor of Pontiac.

[Aardvaark]

Originally Posted by GTJIM You guys (and the whole Western World!) has been subjected to one of the greatest military defeats of all time - the virtual wiping out of the Western Financial System! Now the wobbly Icons are being dealt with - being 'killed off' - along with our jobs. Wake up and smell the camel dung - that is not the problem ... look at China!

Afraid I don't quite follow what you're saying. Are you saying someone else created this current world wide financial mess as an act of war? And that those financial institutions, businesses, governments and private individuals that are on the ropes didn't bring it on themselves through bad and risky decisions and poor regulations and or enforcement?

[PROPEL]

Originally Posted by Aardvaark Afraid I don't quite follow what your saying. Are you saying someone else created this current world wide financial mess as an act of war? And that those financial institutions, businesses, governments and private individuals that are on the ropes didn't bring it on themselves through bad and risky decisions and poor regulations and or enforcement?

I am not sure whether GTJIM was kidding or not, but his comment is not far off the mark. It is a fact that the financial elite have waged hidden "war" on the people for generations, to bring about a new era of feudalism. We are just witnessing their consolidation of wealth. Laugh if you want, but this not '"conspiracy theory" (an overused ad hominem label, anyway). Read history!

Watch

The Money Masters.

The Money Masters.

Or read The Creature from Jekyll Island by G. Edward Griffin.

The Creature from Jekyll Island

The Creature from Jekyll Island

"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."
—Thomas Jefferson, in a letter to the Secretary of the Treasury Albert Gallatin


"You are a den of vipers. I intend to rout you out and by the Eternal God I will rout you out. If the people only understood the rank injustice of our money and banking system, there would be a revolution before morning."
—Andrew Jackson, 1828 (to a group of investment bankers trying to persuade him to renew their central bank charter)


"The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the large centers has owned the government of the U.S. since the days of Andrew Jackson."
—U.S. President Franklin D. Roosevelt in a letter written Nov. 21, 1933 to Colonel E. Mandell House


"The Money Power preys upon the nation in times of peace and conspires against it in times of adversity. It is more despotic than monarchy, more insolent than autocracy, more selfish than bureaucracy."
—Abraham Lincoln


"The death of Lincoln was a disaster for Christendom. There was no man in the United States great enough to wear his boots and the bankers went anew to grab the riches. I fear that foreign bankers with their craftiness and tortuous tricks will entirely control the exuberant riches of America and use it to systematically corrupt civilisation."
—Otto von Bismarck


"Permit me to issue and control the money of the nation and I care not who makes its laws.”
—Meyer Amschal Rothschild, International banker


"We have in this country one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever known. I refer to the Federal Reserve Board. This institution has impoverished the people of the United States and has practically bankrupted our government. It has done this through the corrupt practices of the money vultures who control it. A superstate controlled by international bankers and international industrialists acting together to enslave the world for their own pleasure."
—Louis McFadden, D-PA

[Aardvaark]

Originally Posted by PROPEL I am not sure whether GTJIM was kidding or not, but his comment is not far off the mark. It is a fact that the financial elite have waged hidden "war" on the people for generations, to bring about a new era of feudalism. We are just witnessing their consolidation of wealth. Laugh if you want, but this not '"conspiracy theory" (an overused ad hominem label, anyway). Read history!

Sorry, but I'm not quite ready to buy into yet another new world order theory.

As I see it, this world financial meltdown was brought on by many individuals in all walks of life over the last 20 years or so who made bad decisions in spending way more then they could afford on housing and life styles and the financial institutions allowing them to and even encouraging them to.
I'm no economist, but even I could see people around me, including a couple of relatives going into dangerous debt situations.
And thanks to our governments doing the same, the house of cards couldn't stand forever.
Sorry. I see no evil plot here.

[First opel 1981]

Politics-----BAD!

[Aardvaark]

Originally Posted by First opel 1981 Politics-----BAD!

Particularly when what is being presented sounds like one of Linden Larouche's
presidential campaign ads.
I'm outahere.

[opeljohn]

Let's see. We have allowed our manufacturing to be shipped overseas for years. Our trade deficits mean we are in fact a debtor nation. It was no secrect that our economy before the bust was driven by the housing market. I think anyone who looked at the housing market closely knew it was unsustainable. Corporate greed got us here and unless it is controlled this will happen over and over. Our enemys will not have to wage war to defeat us, we have way to many people here willing to sell us down the river. Someone is eventually going to say " Here is your bill Uncle Sam now pay up or we are taking over".

[baz]

Originally Posted by Aardvaark Isn't reality that young people tend to buy imports or entry level American? And Baby Boomers who buy domestic have pretty much made Buick the default car of the AARP croud. And we are the largest group with the where-with-all to buy these more expensive cars? If it wasn't for BB'ers, Buick would most likely would have gone the way of the DooDoo bird. It would seem that Pontiac has the same problem Oldsmobile had. A rapidly shrinking buyer base. *Shruggs*

otto alert
otto alert
otto alert
otto alert
otto alert
otto alert
otto alert

[baz]

i knew it, it's
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac

hang em, it's their fault

[Aardvaark]

Originally Posted by baz otto alert otto alert otto alert otto alert otto alert otto alert otto alert

Be careful who you fink on! Don't make Pontiac the only thing that gets killed off!
It would be a shame if you had an 'accident' at some future Opel gathering over here in the colonies!

[timemachine]

First Opel 1981 had it right. Politics = Bad (on this site).

I've skimmed the posts and don't want to insult anybody, including presidential candidates and authors I've never heard of.

Pontiac we can talk about. I have worked on goats and loved running them for fun, and still miss my '68 Tempest convertible. New York Times and others say the new G8 is very underappreciated.

Let's stay friends and keep it to Opels. Plenty there to keep us busy.

My first and last entry here unless it deserves a flag.

[Ooooner]

OK... here is an updated article as to why GM is killing off Pontiac.

GM to pull the plug on Pontiac car brand - Apr. 27, 2009

It seems Saturn will be decided later!

[tekenaar]

. . . will Pontiac actually build the Solstice GXP Coupe then?! . . . it appears somewhat contraindicative from all things about/from them lately, wouldn't you say! Haven't really heard from them that they're NOT . . . but haven't heard that they ARE either!!!

[timemachine]

Originally Posted by tekenaar . . . will Pontiac actually build the Solstice GXP Coupe then?! . . . it appears somewhat contraindicative from all things about/from them lately, wouldn't you say! Haven't really heard from them that they're NOT . . . but haven't heard that they ARE either!!!

On the surface you'd think it's doubtful. Then again, they have all the dies and parts, maybe they would sell them or license them to a private firm to make. GM still has to support existing Soltices for 10 years if I am not mistaken. At least owners will have a ton of NOS parts.

Good article in New York Times: http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2009...-too-late/?hpw

It's hard for me to defend GM. That "Transformers" movie has been out for two years and GM is only now bringing the "new" Camaro that starred in the movie to market with a design that was on the boards going back many years and a look that's sharp but already falling out of date.

[opeljohn]

The wife has driven a Grand Am since 1991. The two of them have all in all been pretty good cars. We have been thinking of getting a G8 but price is a bit steep. What all this means is I like Pontiac and was hoping the talk about making it a performance marque for GM would in fact be the way they went. I can not say I am shocked that it is being shut down. At a point in time Olds, Pontiac, Buick, Chevy all became the same car with minor cosmetic changes. I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to figure out it would be cheaper to make them all the same way. I happen to like the Pontiac take on design but our Grand Am and an Olds Alero are kissing cousins. Olds first, now poncho. I am old enough to remember when they looked different from each other. If Saturn was going to be Opel, then they should have just imported them and sold them as such. A low priced German car would have likely been quite popular with the import crowd. I hope Gm can make it, but I am not sold on the too big to fail concept. I would like to see the GXP Coupe be done with the Sky body style, not too big on the Solstice front or rear. It would be a much more useful car with a bit of storage.

[Ooooner]

This article sums it up best... It's politics at its best...

Pontiac Is Dead; Is The Corvette Next? - AOL Autos

[newman27]

I've been in mourning for two days now - can't shake the funk... My hope is that when the 10 years or so have passed, someone steps up for the Solstice and G8 the way Opel GT Source, USA Opel, and others have for our Opels. Otherwise, the car will eventually be quite difficult to keep on the road.

Originally Posted by Ooooner This article sums it up best... It's politics at its best... Pontiac Is Dead; Is The Corvette Next? - AOL Autos

Look at the top 20 cars list in this article. There isn't one car on that list I would get excited about and want to drive. How can a performance / excitement division like Pontiac survive when an appliance vehicle like the Camry (I hear it makes great toast) is the best selling car?!?