COMMENTS - 72 GT Resto Thread

[BQS4]

Keith;
I vote no shield, as you stated, I like to see the whole manifold, also, if you had to remove the head, if it were not in place, you could access the two center bolts without having to remove the carb. As to "heat soak", here in Hotlanta, it can get hot, and having been through quite a few with Opels and no heat shields, I have yet to have one boil out/over, or whatever, in other words, absolutely no problems running without the heat shield.
Gene

[hrcollinsjr]

Originally Posted by BQS4 ... if it were not in place, you could access the two center bolts without having to remove the carb.

You can trim about 1/2" of the heat shield and it will allow you to get to these bolts with a wrench. I trimmed mine leaving the bead roll.

Harold

[opelspyder]

I think we have desided to run without it. Seems like it causes more trouble sometimes than it is worth.
Keith

[2 Fast 4 U]

Nice work on the brake drums, aren't you afraid that the heat will eventually destroy the coating??

[opelspyder]

Well, the way I was figuring is that they could be painted or coated. The coating seems to withstand more heat than regular paint, and is hard to remove once on, I feel we have a better chance of it lasting than any other style of coating, or paint.
Keith

[jerseydave]

What do you plan on doing for the wiring harness, a generic kit, custom harness to match or NOS?

[opelspyder]

The wiring harness that was in the car had all kinds of things wired to it. Get this- radio and other items were installed in this car, but the steering column was never removed??? I bet they had a heck of a time pulling that stuff out. Anyways, I had a nice 1972 GT that I parted out with a wiring harness that I believe to have never even had a fuse replaced. The cover didn't have any marks or anything, everything looked sweet, the front headlights were never rewired so it will be a good replacement. I will go in and replace the rubber coated wiring for the headlights, and have new micro switches for them as well. I use only OEM style terminals (flag or packard style) I will also use correct headlight connectors, I hate those prewired connectors that only have 18 guage wire. I want a better quality connection there. I will also be eliminating the seat belt wiring and adding in a few things such as a start relay, and be replacing the steering column with a rebuilt one-meaning coated and rewired with good ignition switch. The dash wiring will be left the same, I will do tests to make sure connections are good and all. The wiring routing will be factory as well. The harness that is in the GT isn't all that bad, as Destec explains it can be improved upon. I kind of think by going with a painless wiring harness, you are adding lots of work that isn't really necessary. I've installed some easy wiring harnesses, and they are for basic things. The GT has lots of things incorporated that would take some real figuring out to make work in one of those harnesses
Keith

[newman27]

Originally Posted by opelspyder The wiring harness that was in the car had all kinds of things wired to it. Get this- radio and other items were installed in this car, but the steering column was never removed??? I bet they had a heck of a time pulling that stuff out. Anyways, I had a nice 1972 GT that I parted out with a wiring harness that I believe to have never even had a fuse replaced. The cover didn't have any marks or anything, everything looked sweet, the front headlights were never rewired so it will be a good replacement.

This is one of many examples of Keith "going the extra mile" for this car. Having a sound wiring harness is so important and my car has had electrical issues from day one (that being the day I bought it back in '86). For the record, I swear I had nothing to do with installing the radio - that was done by a car audio shop just days after I bought the car (the stock AM radio being the first thing to go when a then 21 year old gets a hot new car ). It even had a cassette player - Ooooo....

Matt

[tekenaar]

Originally Posted by newman27 This is one of many examples of Keith "going the extra mile" for this car. Having a sound wiring harness is so important and my car has had electrical issues from day one (that being the day I bought it back in '86). For the record, I swear I had nothing to do with installing the radio - that was done by a car audio shop just days after I bought the car (the stock AM radio being the first thing to go when a then 21 year old gets a hot new car). It even had a cassette player - Ooooo.... Matt

. . . at least it wasn't an 8-track!!

[newman27]

Originally Posted by tekenaar . . . at least it wasn't an 8-track!!

Last time I saw an 8-track was back in the late seventies - as I recall it had an Engelbert Humperdinck tape stuck in it...

[jlthunder]

OK OK, let's get this back on topic

[kwilford]

Originally Posted by opelspyder When the car comes back from the sand blaster I will post pictures of the rear mounting. Keith

Keith, I don't suppose the GT is back from the blaster yet? I have my rotisserie built, and it just needs a few tweaks (it needs a bit lower pivot point, and the length wise tie bar needs clamp bolts, and the whole thing needs paint.) Last weekend I actually had it up in the air and rotating . But I don't like the way I have the rear mounted. I used 1/2" bolts through the upper bumper mounts, spaced about 1" out from the body with heavy wall 7/8" tubing, and then a cross bar out of 1X2 rectangular tubing. It works OK, but I would like to have the rear cross bar farther away from the body, which will place too large a moment arm on the bolts, which are in a single plane and so not as stiff as they need to be. I have started making a different set up using the same heavy wall tubing mounted and welded right through the cross bar (to stiffen it up), and a smaller bar angled down to the lower bumperette mount (I found the 8 mm captive nut can be quite easily pushed inwards and then a 1/2" bolt will fit through the hole).

But I would really prefer to have a mount through the tail-light holes, so the tail panel is unobstructed for media blasting. I presume you have mounted a cross brace over the shock cross member, and then bolted length-wise rails to that, or some such thing. Any photos or descriptions would be really appreciated. TIA

[soybean]

Keith L, in post #51, did you use the bronze bushing, or the roller bushing? If it was the roller bushing, do you remember the part nos? I believe it was from a Pinto if I remember correctly, I may be wrong. Thanks Jarrell

[opelspyder]

Hey Keith,
I haven't forgotten you here, but you are correct I haven't got the car back from the blasters yet, actually picking up today. Anyways, I did not use the rear shock towers as mounts. The problem with the GT is there is not really that good of mounts for a rotisserie. The front bumper brackets work, but I had to make a piece that obstructs the belly pan a bit to add bracing, I found without it the front frame pieces wanted to twist on my last car on the rotisserie. The rear was actually simple, I looked inside to see what might be a good mounting point, I did not even think to mount like you have it (reason being you see so many GTs with the bumper being pushed just slightly and bending up the rear panel ) I opted for the gas tank mounting flanges. There are 4 bolt holes and I basically took flat bar from one side to the other, to connect two holes. (So you would have two pieces of flat bar for both sets of holes.) I bolted them down, and then welded flat bar to connect the original two pieces-basically building a square. The spacing for the gas tank mounts are lower than the taillight holes, so I had to space up the bracket, until I could run a heavy piece of angle straight through the taillight hole, then welded all this up. I also made some small crossbraces within my frame work to strengthen the frame work. ( I will send a picture of this Monday for you) Also once the pieces of angle are on the outside of the car. I made several holes where it can be bolted up the another piece of frame work. What happened the first time I set this up was I had the mounts directly out the taillights and straight out where the bumper in the front mounted. I still had too much weight in the bottom of the car and I could not balance it on the rotisserie. (Which is very unsafe) So I basically went down with both brackets at 90 degress, and then out to the rotisserie to get lower to the center of gravity. Don't think you can just hook one up on the rotisserie and it will be able to spin with one hand and be perfect. They need to have a counterbalance contraption built in. I have mine setup where I alone can spin it to any position in 360 degrees and it will not want to move back or spin on its own. I don't even have to lock it in position. That is the goal you want to obtain when doing one on the rotisserie. When you add or remove weight, you need to rebalance to be sure it will not flop around on the stands. I will have several pictures come Monday on this car and will take some better picture for you on this in particular.
Keith

[opelspyder]

I used a roller type I got through the part store, they are available, I perfer the roller type, but the bronze is okay too, I never had either one fail. Seems like long ago I got them through Parts America.com for around $4.00, I will look through some reciepts if I think about it.
Keith

[soybean]

I found it Keith, Dorman Clutch Pilot Bearing & Bushing Part Number: 14657
through Parts America.com. Link Thanks for the tip. Jarrell

[opelspyder]

Here is the picture of the inner rear bracket for you Keith

[kwilford]

Originally Posted by opelspyder Here is the picture of the inner rear bracket for you Keith

Thanks Keith, I had eyed those tank mounts, I just wasn't sure if they were strong enough to take the weight of the car. I think I might weld them up a bit as they attach to the unibody first, as IIRC, the welding on them (and MUCH of the body welding from the factory) is pretty darn poor, with little penetration and very short beads. I think I can use 1X2 rectangular tubing on the flat as the two cross pieces, then mount 2X2's with spacers out the tail light holes. Then they will mount to a 2X2 cross bar attached to the rotisserie. MUCH better than my original plan to use the rear bumper mounting holes.

I prefer to bolt these brackets up as much as possible rather than welding, so the pieces can be disassembled when done, and even used in other applications (like, say, a '75 SportWagon that's next on deck).

I came up with a pretty good way to mount the front. I used a 2X2 (I actually started with a 1X2, then doubled it up and welded the seam) and extended it farther back along the outside of the "frame rail" behind the bumper mounting holes. I then drilled an extra hole through the frame rail from inside the engine compartment so that the bar was held in place by three bolts on each side, and were "deeper" into the body than just the bumper mounting brackets. The trick was to make them long enough so that the frame rail cross member (where the horns mount) was in-between the bracket rails to add sideways stiffness. They are very stiff, and don't show any deflection when supporting the body in any angle. I have attached some photos below. Since these were taken, I have added a second bolt to where the braces attach to the rotisserie cross bar (all bracket bolts are 1/2", and at least Gr5, and most are Gr8; the six bolts that mount the brackets to the frame rails are Gr5 3/8").

As for "balance", it is all related to the height of the pivot point in relation to the centre of gravity. The place where the rotisserie actually mounts to the body doesn't matter at all, it's all in the pivot point placement. It's VERY important that the two ends are the same height as each other, as in they are aligned such that the pivots "point" at one another on a common plane. Then it is simply a matter of adjusting the body up or down to balance the top and bottom CofG. The side-to-side is easy, as the centre is obvious. But it took a couple of tries to balance the top and bottom. My first try had the pivot too high (in these photos), so the "bottom" was too heavy and it would tend to rotate to the upright position from the sideways position. Once the pivot is centred, the body is easily rotated by hand and stays in place when stopped. I have locking pins, but I plan on welding 1/2" nuts and using a jam bolt on the pivot so I can lock it at any angle.

I will be creating a photo editorial thread once I am done.

Thanks for the photos and good luck on the GT restoration.

[soybean]

Darn it Keith W, you're going to have to make me build something else. Good idea, once again. Jarrell

[azopelnut]

Originally Posted by opelspyder Okay, body is back with several surprises. There were a lot of previous patches used and covered up. We have our work cut out for us on this one, but I can't wait to start repairing the metal. This goes to show that one might have been in paint for years, but the sandblaster tells all and this is one of those instances. Keith

I have the same jack point issue that you revealed in the third pic. (I know there are many GT's out there with this weakness). From your past pics I know you are very thorough in your work....can I ask that you detail this repair with pics????

[opelspyder]

All of this will be detailed with pics, no problem there.
Keith

[newman27]

Post #54 - "Patches" (Or, as I am calling it, "Frankenstein's Monster"):

So, this is me when Keith first sent the pictures of the sandblasted body:

1) "Where the #$*@! did those come from?

2) "How in the heck do you fix something like that?"

3) "How much is that gonna cost?"

But a good phone discussion with Keith and his creative solutions as well as my continued commitment to this car and the project means the show will go on! My wife and I are driving up there on Saturday to see the car in person and discuss next steps so I'm really excited about that!

Even knowing the patches were there wouldn't have changed my mind - I would have still bought the car and I would still be restoring it today. But, for the sake of discussion, if you were buying a car with my "patch work" of repairs, how would you determine they were there to begin with? The patches are metal so I don't think a magnet would help. And, they were riveted in and then smoothed over prior to painting so they were "invisible" (at least to my eye 21 years ago when I bought the car). Ideas?

[namba209]

Matt, it doesn't look THAT bad. Willit? had much more cancer when I started that project, but I was lucky, that it wasn't in a major structural area, except for the driver's door hinge area. The jack point, trailing arm area will have to be addressed, but Keith will have a good fix for that I'm sure, from what we've seen so far. Willit? spent over 90 days in the body shop and came out looking just spiffy. The external and internal body panels were cut out and new pieces welded back in, ground down smooth, and with a little filler looked just like it came from the factory. I'm sure yours will be the same. As for detecting the previous repairs, only a trained eye and maybe a weak magnet would be able to find them. Take heart, your GT will be done right and give you miles of smiles later on. It is good to see a caring, body restoration expert do his magic.

[newman27]

Thanks Ron for the insight based on your experiences. I guess it was just shocking at first because I have no frame of reference. I am really looking forward to seeing those patches go away!

Matt

[blancojp]

Originally Posted by newman27 Thanks Ron for the insight based on your experiences. I guess it was just shocking at first because I have no frame of reference. I am really looking forward to seeing those patches go away! Matt

Matt I would not worry about it too much, In the 25 years I've been restoring cars, I have seen worst. Your car is not bad overall but make sure internal panels are solid before you repair the external cancer. Most of our customers do the same thing you did, panic big time and say "what the hell did I get into!!". I have seen cars that have a $4k paint job with 1/8" of bondo on the quaters and fiberglass patches everywhere.

Fact remains all metal can be replaced and your vehicle can be whole again. As to cost, all depends on the level of perfection you are trying to achieve and the hourly rate charged by the shop. Time and materials can amount to a good penny if you want things done right.

Just have a tall drink and think of how many people will envy your car when it is complete.