Which Opel Handles Best?

[jlthunder]

There seems to be some discussion on which Opel handles the best. Please voice your views and vote

[tom_laan]

hmm interesting topic. but i can't vote. i haven't driven one of them yet, i have a gt but only since a couple of weeks and it need to be fixed before i can use it. hehe but i would say the gt.. because it is purely made as a sports car. it only has 2 seats (less weight) and the others started as normal cars. not as a sportscar... if i'm correct.

[ConreroGT]

watch out Tom, your opening a huge can of worms.

I would probably guess the GT is pretty low on the handling list compared to the rest....unfortuantly. I'm not being biased either, I have a 72 GT. It's all relative tho. If you enjoy the handling of your car and thats all you've driven, then it's the best. Keep enjoying it and leave it at that.

[opelbits]

Ok, so what makes the Rally handle better than the Luxus? The 3.67 can't make that much of a difference....can it?

Maybe some extra weight in the Luxus, but with a 73-74, are you really going to notice a little less weight when you have those heavy bumpers slinging around?

Are the spring/swaybar rates different?

[BQS4]

Well, you didn't need to list all the various models of the Mantas and Asconas, as the Manta/Asconas are all set up the same, save for the Manta Rallye has different gearing, but, that's not handling. The choices should be:
1. Manta/Ascona
2. GT
3. Kadett
I list the Kadetts as they did arrive in this country sporting swaybars, at least the Wagon we had, did. The Kadett Rallye had them too. The GT, as far as a true "US spec'd" version did not have swaybars.

[azopelnut]

The Manta /Ascona handle better by far in stock form (a quick look at the front suspensions will show you the reason) but a GT can be improved a great deal over stock.

[nobody]

Tom the GT started as a Kadette. One option on the poll that is missing is a modified GT or other types. The GT has more parts readily available to make it handle better so that is how I voted after driving my share of Opels. With the exception of some rare cars and Rallies the north American suspensions were detuned at the factory.

Being completely honest I hate that soft suspension they pushed on the US. A big reason I like the GTs is because it is easily fixed and the parts are out there to do it. Bounce per ounce a modified GT suspension will outdo all the rest in my opinion. JM2CW

[jlthunder]

Well I broke the models down into each trim level because if I didn't then someone would want the Raylle seperated from the rest. Sooooo if you want the grand total, just add up the %'s for the Mantas or Kadetts's to get a total percentage from that group.

I know my '72 Raylle rode and handled much differently(better) than my ' 74 Luxus and the GT is completly different.

Remember, this is just an information poll, nothing scientific.

[baz]

see why i told you how to do it for yourself now

[jlthunder]

I'm a supervisor in a service group at a drug company so I know I can't make everyone happy It is interesting to see everybody's "critique" of the poll.

If the GT gets a higher % but the total % of the Manta's exceeds the GT we can get into the never ending debate of which handles better!!!

[benncojr]

Originally Posted by nobody Tom the GT started as a Kadette. One option on the poll that is missing is a modified GT or other types. The GT has more parts readily available to make it handle better so that is how I voted after driving my share of Opels. With the exception of some rare cars and Rallies the north American suspensions were detuned at the factory. Being completely honest I hate that soft suspension they pushed on the US. A big reason I like the GTs is because it is easily fixed and the parts are out there to do it. Bounce per ounce a modified GT suspension will outdo all the rest in my opinion. JM2CW

Here!! Here! I agree with you!! The GT has a lot more potental to get it handle better than it did when it came out of the factory. With it close to being a 50% 50% balance from front to back and from right to left, it makes if a very fun car to drive!!

[baz]

i think it should be kept to a "standard setup" debate as any car will handle better if you throw money at it ,my old73 1.6s mantaA was much better than my 70 gt to the point i would say that over 100 miles of cross country(what we call B roads) the smaller powered manta would be a lot quicker purely due to the front suspension setup

[greensmurf20]

after driving both a GT and manta in stock form, "STOCK" being operative word, manta is much better than a GT, and even better than a GT with addco swaybars. i took the tires off my GT for this manta, so tires are not a issue to take into consideration, it is all the car.

shaved 2 seconds off best time on 29th street and 8 seconds off my best time for whiskey run. keep in mind the GT is 200 pounds or so heavier, and mine happens to have 20 more horse or so than my manta, GT is also a 4 speed with obvious better aerodynamics. never got over 85 on those roads where with the GT i could hit 105 or so, just all made up in handling, but as dave said, there are so many more mods for the GT available and easier to fit larger tires, the GT probably does have more capabilites for bolt on upgrades to handle better than the others.

[baz]

funny jared but here its easyer to get uprated gear for the manta

[greensmurf20]

i dont care what i drive so long as its blitzed. these things hold up to the abuse it seems, took less than 10,000 miles to blow 3rd and 4th gear out of my S10.

some kid in a F150 decided to pick on me for driving a fugly car, as his was more fugly in my opinion, rusted out badly and 4 different colors ontop of the 2 it was supposed to be, must abeen a stick and put int he clutch as he rolled next to it on 4 lane highway and rapped his duals in my ear, which of course got me ticked, he stomped it, dropped manta into 2nd doing 60 and held her there till about 75ish and the poor little ford never got back up with me, sad a V8 manual trans vehicle can't keep up with a 75 horse 4 banger with an auto. kinda shocked me, was afraid i was gonna make a foot outta myself tryin to get by him.

[baz]

power to weight ratio get it right and you win every time

[ging]

The car that handles best ... is whichever one I'm handling at the time.

[RallyBob]

On a tight twisty road the Ascona will beat 'em all, but the Manta won't be far behind. And I remember a 'road' test from 1971 that compared a then-new '71 Manta to a '70 GT and the Manta was 4 seconds per lap faster on a road racing course, even though it gave up a bit of HP and aerodynamics.

But with enough parts, tires, and tuning, they can all be made to turn pretty well for cars of their era. The GT will just ride a bit rougher than a comparably modified Manta or Ascona.

Bob

[Motor Mouth]

A great debate, but so many Opels missing......the one that springs to mind immediately is the Kadett C Coupe, where as I'm, guessing the poll is refering to the 'B' model.

The Kadett C was available at a similar time to the Manta A and so it should be in there and even though I only had a Kadett C 1.2 SR Coupe it stuck to the road like glue....it was akin to driving a go-kart.......one can only wonder what the GT/E was like.

[GoinManta]

Originally Posted by jlthunder I know my '72 Raylle rode and handled much differently(better) than my ' 74 Luxus and the GT is completly different.

The Manta Rallye is a little different, it has stiffer shocks. Considering they re all 30 years old, I would guess none have thier original shocks anymore so that point is moot. Other than that all US Mantas are the same, in Europe they had 185/sr13s mounted on teh rallyes and GTE models. Again, anyone driving a Manta that hasnt changed the tired from the 168/13 bias ply by now needs thier heads examined

There maybe other differences from year to year, rubber bushing changes, etc..

Also there IS a difference in handling of the Asconas to Mantas. The 4 door is heavier and the 2 door lighter than the Manta. Which affects handling. Told the 4 door is more balanced, while the 2 door is a tad quicker.

AS for the GT having parts availble... It needs them. The Manta does not.

Lets compare avaiable parts to improve suspension

Adjustable Panhard rod, is a custom part for either car.
Poly Bushings - Available for both
Performance/Gas shocks - Available for both
Custom Springs - Available for both (they are again custom parts)

Thats all the Manta needs. Unless you want to go Bob Legere on it..

As for the GT, you need to ADD these :

Front sway bar (Manta already has it stock)
Rear sway bar (Manta already has it stock)
Shackles, or fiberglass leaf spring (Manta has a modern coil over shock design)

You GT owners can keep trying to convince yourself otherwise, but no matter how much work goes into the stock GT suspension, its still a modified Kadett suspension. The Manta/Ascona design was years ahead of the GTs design.

[N61WP]

But don't forget one of the most important items affecting handling are the tires. The modern tires are soooo advanced from what these cars came with. Not to mention that most people use larger then stock sizes now also when they replace them. Judging by other cars I have driven, I'd bet that my GT would pull almost a G on a skid pad with the 205/50/15 Faulkens I'm using.

Case in point...I had a friend that autoXed a MG Midget, full race, slicks, etc. Midgets had an ancient suspension design. Even though the car had a full cage in it, you could actually see the body twist on course. The tires got that much grip.

IMHO,
Jc

[GoinManta]

Originally Posted by greensmurf20 as dave said, there are so many more mods for the GT available and easier to fit larger tires, the GT probably does have more capabilites for bolt on upgrades to handle better than the others.

Ah.. first I heard that one. The Manta can fit just as big of tires as the GT< if not bigger. I have see 245s in a Manta without doing much more than rolling the lips of the wheel arches. Vs, the problems the GT has with binding on the front control arm.

As for more capabilities for "upgrades", again it needs them where the Manta already starts where the GT wants to be. It takes a lot of modification to get a GT up to handle like a Manta/Ascona does stock. So thats really not an argument for the GT.

Am I biased...? Of course... but I have owned a Kaddett, a GT, a Manta, a Ascona, a Sportwagon, a Commodore B, and lastly a Bitter SC. Which is why I have two Mantas in my garage. Overall my favorite Opel, and as much for its handling as for its looks.

Charles

[greensmurf20]

i'm not seeing how GT is beating everything else. if you say a paticular car is the best cuz you've only driven that 1 car on the list, its not a good judgment against the others.

[jlthunder]

GS20;

Actually the Manta is in the lead. Add up the %'s of all 3 Mantas and they are out in front.

I agree with your logic. I've driven Manta's and GT's, this is why I created this poll.

I have also noticed an increased interest in Manta's over the last year or two and wondered if the handling was the main reason for the renewed interest.

[GoinManta]

Originally Posted by jlthunder I have also noticed an increased interest in Manta's over the last year or two and wondered if the handling was the main reason for the renewed interest.

That or head room, or trunk space, or leg room, or....

BTW Mantas aren't ugly cars by any stretch. The design may not be in teh same area as the GT, but they are as good looking as the GT in all aspects. They are just as distinctive and attention grabbing as the GT now.

Thats the key.. NOW. When the Manta came out it was distinctive as it is now. Problem was that its basic profile and elements of design were stolen by the Ford Maverick, Chevy Vega, just to name a few. While cars like the Maverick and Vega shared similar profiles, and elements of design, they were friggin hideous in the aspects they didnt share with the Manta. But they looked close enough that the Manta blended in with the multitude of other small sporty econo boxs. Most which were crappy cars to add insult to injury... heck, ford produced close to 500,000 Mavericks and thier Mercury counterpart, and don't even want to think of the thousands of Vegas that were out there. With the eventual demise of the other cars, they are now getting recognized for the great looking car they are.

Charles