Nice 1969 1.1L GT for sale
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Thread: Nice 1969 1.1L GT for sale

  1. #1
    Super Moderator Ooooner's Avatar
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    Nice 1969 1.1L GT for sale

    I just found out about this and thought I would share with you. I’m not going to buy it but maybe someone could be interested.

    I believe he is asking $16,500.

    Jim Norris
    101 Canterbury Rd.
    Kings Mtn. NC. 28086
    Phone - 704-730-5749
    Cell - 704-300-0576
    Roy Bell
    1973 Opel GT
    Concord, North Carolina
    Carolina Opel Club

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  3. #2
    4,000 Post Club norbertone.gt371's Avatar
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    Ding Dong
    The third Round is started
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    Pedal Smasher Autoholic's Avatar
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    The owner is disillusioned to think that GT is worth $16,500. The mirrors aren't correct, the washer fluid bottle is incorrect and in the wrong spot, both fenders look like they have been replaced or at least removed but not welded back in as they should have been at the rocker panel, the rear trim strip is gone, the back panel probably shouldn't be black, the interior isn't correct for a European 1.1 as it should be a basic black 451 interior instead of the luxury black 751 interior, the dash was cut to install a modern radio head unit, an odd red button was added to the dash on the left side, the clutch cable was painted yellow which is a sign of a sloppy paint job, the seat belt buckles aren't original, it's missing the door rubber stop at the top of the driver side door, and the parking brake isn't stock.

    Am I nit-picking? Yes, but that is par for the course when the asking price is for a #2. In so many ways, the difference between a #1 and a #2 is that the #2 was driven to the car show and not trailed there. Unless it's a very unique project car, like the silver Aero GT that was built off of a regular 1.9, a #2 car should be more or less flawless and look like it hasn't changed at all since it left the factory but has been enjoyed. A trained eye shouldn't be able to list a bunch of things wrong about the car from just looking at photos. If someone can do that, it's a #3 at best. The market has spoken, the highest bid on the recent eBay listing was $10,100 which is a respectable amount right in line for this GT, if not too much for it. The absence of the rear trim strip is very suspect. The owner just didn't like the result of the bidding on eBay and I bet some of the people bidding knew GT's enough to know what to look for.

    I'm sorry if I'm coming off as a jerk, but I'm not going to beat around the bush just to protect someone's feelings. If someone isn't going to restore a vehicle to factory correct condition or clearly go beyond factory perfection (think Singer Vehicle Design), don't be surprised when that car isn't worth as much. Classic cars are money pits and very few people know how to sink lots of money into one and still make a good profit off of it.
    Last edited by Autoholic; 07-24-2019 at 07:23 PM.
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    "Autoholism is an incurable addiction medicated daily with car porn." ~Zeppi

    1973 Opel GT project car - Plans: 2.5L CIH, Weber 38 DGAS, Getrag 240, Lowered 1", Watts link, exterior color - Rainforest Green Pearl, interior color - tan

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    Super Moderator Ooooner's Avatar
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    Yea... I saw some of the things you are talking about. Nothing wrong with a good critique. I thought the price was high, too. Anyway, just posting as a favor... don’t really know the guy...
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    Roy Bell
    1973 Opel GT
    Concord, North Carolina
    Carolina Opel Club

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    4,000 Post Club norbertone.gt371's Avatar
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    Every day a dummkopf wake up.

    As I say in second punch round:You can not see under the sales paint.Its a European and I see lot shells before
    paint.Never buy without looking in person and with a magnet in hand!There is to much wrong for me.
    Btw.I buy just the same chrome plastic mirrors in Pontiac style. $ 18,95 with free shippent from the Philipines
    So I must write 18.950

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    Yup. These coals are all but embers now.

    I did reach out to him last week but I felt kind of brushed off.

    Anyway, I started doing due diligence and everything that Autoholic and Norbert said (we'll stage an intervention for Auto soon) is positively identified and on target. Birds affirmed!!

    I have concerns that it could have sustained heavy damage at one point to the right front too. I would of course have to inspect it myself or have a reputable shop that knows the older chassis assemblies in order to be sure. There are additional indicators too of this possibility
    other than just evidence that a fender was removed at some point in time.

    I would still entertain it simply to have Euro example sitting around, but at this point I would be buying it with the knowledge that it would need to be taken down. I at least can use the incorrect parts on some of my other projects.
    Last edited by Porschopel; 07-24-2019 at 09:18 PM.
    If I tell ya a rabbit can pull a freight train... Then son, hitch his ass up!

  9. #7
    2000 Post Club soybean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Autoholic View Post
    The owner is disillusioned to think that GT is worth $16,500. The mirrors aren't correct, the washer fluid bottle is incorrect and in the wrong spot, both fenders look like they have been replaced or at least removed but not welded back in as they should have been at the rocker panel, the rear trim strip is gone, the back panel probably shouldn't be black, the interior isn't correct for a European 1.1 as it should be a basic black 451 interior instead of the luxury black 751 interior, the dash was cut to install a modern radio head unit, an odd red button was added to the dash on the left side, the clutch cable was painted yellow which is a sign of a sloppy paint job, the seat belt buckles aren't original, it's missing the door rubber stop at the top of the driver side door, and the parking brake isn't stock.

    Am I nit-picking? Yes, but that is par for the course when the asking price is for a #2. In so many ways, the difference between a #1 and a #2 is that the #2 was driven to the car show and not trailed there. Unless it's a very unique project car, like the silver Aero GT that was built off of a regular 1.9, a #2 car should be more or less flawless and look like it hasn't changed at all since it left the factory but has been enjoyed. A trained eye shouldn't be able to list a bunch of things wrong about the car from just looking at photos. If someone can do that, it's a #3 at best. The market has spoken, the highest bid on the recent eBay listing was $10,100 which is a respectable amount right in line for this GT, if not too much for it. The absence of the rear trim strip is very suspect. The owner just didn't like the result of the bidding on eBay and I bet some of the people bidding knew GT's enough to know what to look for.

    I'm sorry if I'm coming off as a jerk, but I'm not going to beat around the bush just to protect someone's feelings. If someone isn't going to restore a vehicle to factory correct condition or clearly go beyond factory perfection (think Singer Vehicle Design), don't be surprised when that car isn't worth as much. Classic cars are money pits and very few people know how to sink lots of money into one and still make a good profit off of it.
    Man, you picked up on all of that, that quick? I was just going to say pretty car and pretty high price. But after looking closely at what you pointed out, you are entirely correct. You can't see my car now. It's cobbled together, wires everywhere etc. So no, not my car, I'd be lucky to be a 4. Haggerty likes it enough to give me 6 grand replacement on it, so on that part, I'm happy. I'd have to say mine is a 20 ft. It looks good 20 ft away. Jarrell
    Last edited by soybean; 07-24-2019 at 09:01 PM.
    You lose your dreams, you lose your mind. (The Rolling Stones)

  10. #8
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    ^^^^^

    LOL... I know how you feel. I acquired 3 projects not too long ago that are so bad that I'm jealous of yours!!!!!
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    If I tell ya a rabbit can pull a freight train... Then son, hitch his ass up!

  11. #9
    Pedal Smasher Autoholic's Avatar
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    Well Jarrell, this isn't the first day I've looked at photos of the car. The now expired eBay listing that had its own thread was the first time I saw pictures of the car. So, I've looked at the photos a few times. Much like judging a car show, if you notice a couple things wrong with a car you'll start to look closer and then find more things wrong with it. But, if I can do that with just photos... I'd be a savage appraiser in person. If the owner has a realistic price in mind, this isn't an issue. It's when someone thinks their badly restored car is a national treasure worthy of the Smithsonian that this becomes a problem, or when they see a pristine version sell for big bucks that they suddenly think their #8 mission to the Moon project car is worth the price of a gently used Camry. Very few brands and vehicles can command that kind of value in rust bucket condition, and usually the make starts with A, F, L, or M and is very old.

    My GT is a #3. The body is really good, it has a couple very small dents and a few chips in the paint but no rust. If I wanted to keep it yellow, you could fix the minor problems with the paint for like $500 in all likelihood around my town. I cared about the body and not really the paint because I plan to repaint it a different color. The engine was rebuilt and turned into a 2.0L. The interior is mostly good, the driver's seat would need new seat covers and a little bit of foam on the outside seat bolster. It needs new floor mats. The carb would need rebuilding or you'd need to check for vacuum leaks, it doesn't idle is the problem. It can start however. It has both the stock radio and an aftermarket radio installed on the side of the tunnel. Aftermarket 16" rims with good tires on it, the original 5 rims with good tires on at least the 4 main rims are in storage and the spare is still in the car. My plan is to put a 2.5L and a Getrag 240 in it with suspension upgrades and a tan interior. So, the whole car will be stripped down to bare metal, repainted and then rebuilt better than new anyways. I needed a solid starting point however and this is a 20 footer. I wound up buying the very first GT I ever saw back in HS, 10 years later. My estimate at the time I purchased it, was roughly $5-6k and I had a few reasonable opinions of $5k. The family wanted $7k and they were willing to let me pay that over a little bit of time so I didn't have to cough up that all at once, since they knew me. I didn't mind paying a little high, all things considered in this situation. GT's in NM are pretty dang rare and unless you are buying a shell, it can be hard to know the condition of the body without putting your hands on it and running a magnet across the body. And yes, I used a welding magnet covered in painter's tape to check the body out in critical spots. If there is bondo on my GT, it's either not in the rust prone areas or it's pretty small patches for like a door ding.

    So, when I critique a GT it's not like mine is void of issues and better then everyone else's. The body and paint is the biggest factor, does it need attention? If so, can it be touched up to fix the problems or will it need a full paint job? That can ding a GT like $500 to say $3,500.
    Ooooner and soybean like this.
    "Autoholism is an incurable addiction medicated daily with car porn." ~Zeppi

    1973 Opel GT project car - Plans: 2.5L CIH, Weber 38 DGAS, Getrag 240, Lowered 1", Watts link, exterior color - Rainforest Green Pearl, interior color - tan

  12. #10
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    While Auto wants a modified version which in its own right can hold its value for the performance upgrades, I'm looking for originality. I don't necessarily want a concours and in fact would probably not buy a concours (simply because I WILL drive it to shows), but I do want a very high 3 to 2.

    Just because a car makes 'barnfind' doesn't mean it's in the 2 or higher range. In fact, I would say most cars on Barnfind are lower with the caveat that it can be MADE #2 or higher thus the 'barnfind' part of it.

    I would agree that 10,100 was a VERY solid offer. I was very surprised when he didn't take the even higher offers he had on his previous auctions for it.

    For my part, I think I'm out at this point. I just don't think I'm willing to match or outbid 10100 for that example.
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  13. #11
    4,000 Post Club norbertone.gt371's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Porschopel View Post
    While Auto wants a modified version which in its own right can hold its value for the performance upgrades, I'm looking for originality. I don't necessarily want a concours and in fact would probably not buy a concours (simply because I WILL drive it to shows), but I do want a very high 3 to 2.

    Just because a car makes 'barnfind' doesn't mean it's in the 2 or higher range. In fact, I would say most cars on Barnfind are lower with the caveat that it can be MADE #2 or higher thus the 'barnfind' part of it.

    I would agree that 10,100 was a VERY solid offer. I was very surprised when he didn't take the even higher offers he had on his previous auctions for it.

    For my part, I think I'm out at this point. I just don't think I'm willing to match or outbid 10100 for that example.
    I be with you what you decided. One you must know too.This 1100 is a european updatet model and not a rare exported US-Version. Europeans buy more 1100 GT so it is not so rare.
    Look for a real luxury US-1100 and be more happy.Special in rust theme1

    Norbert
    Last edited by norbertone.gt371; 07-25-2019 at 08:57 AM.
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  14. #12
    Super Moderator Ooooner's Avatar
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    The guy sent me an e-mail to let me know he put this car on Craigslist yesterday. Not sure why he needs to tell me this.... Somebody is going to get suckered in...
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    Roy Bell
    1973 Opel GT
    Concord, North Carolina
    Carolina Opel Club

  15. #13
    4,000 Post Club norbertone.gt371's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ooooner View Post
    The guy sent me an e-mail to let me know he put this car on Craigslist yesterday. Not sure why he needs to tell me this.... Somebody is going to get suckered in...
    The headquarters must know when a great car should be go out of the sight

    https://www.classiccarcommunity.com/...pel+club/2258/
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