How would one go about taking a fwd ecotec engine and adapting it to be rwd in a GT. I know the ovious: motor mounts and possibly transmission mount and hoping that the stick shift holes line up. I also have to worry about the computer and all that stuff.
2.2 ecotec in a GT
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As far as I know, no one has done this swap yet, at least not in the US. So this is essentially uncharted territory. I think you will be on your own to fit it.
If you are serious about trying this, I suggest you first try to find a donor vehicle or at least a vehicle you can measure the Ecotec engine from. I don't know if the engine is too tall, if the oil pan is an issue, if you will need to make a custom header (exhaust will be on the driver's side under the hood), or if you will need to cut the heater box to clear the FI intake manifold, etc.....
Like I said, you will have to determine all these things yourself.
Another issue is the bellhousing, the pilot bearing, the flywheel/clutch, the transmission type to use, and the driveshaft. Expect to have to upgrade the cooling system, as the stock Ecotec makes double the HP of a late model Opel GT, plus being an injected emissions-compliant engine, it runs at significantly higher temps than our old Opels. You'll need to replace all the fuel lines to accept high pressure, install a high pressure fuel pump, wire the ECU into the car, make a custom exhaust....
You have a lot of planning to do to make it work. Please let us know how it works out, I've often considered using an Ecotec in an older Opel. Good luck.
Bob
If you are serious about trying this, I suggest you first try to find a donor vehicle or at least a vehicle you can measure the Ecotec engine from. I don't know if the engine is too tall, if the oil pan is an issue, if you will need to make a custom header (exhaust will be on the driver's side under the hood), or if you will need to cut the heater box to clear the FI intake manifold, etc.....
Like I said, you will have to determine all these things yourself.
Another issue is the bellhousing, the pilot bearing, the flywheel/clutch, the transmission type to use, and the driveshaft. Expect to have to upgrade the cooling system, as the stock Ecotec makes double the HP of a late model Opel GT, plus being an injected emissions-compliant engine, it runs at significantly higher temps than our old Opels. You'll need to replace all the fuel lines to accept high pressure, install a high pressure fuel pump, wire the ECU into the car, make a custom exhaust....
You have a lot of planning to do to make it work. Please let us know how it works out, I've often considered using an Ecotec in an older Opel. Good luck.
Bob
You may want to check out the search engine on this site, type in engine swap and you'll find a wealth of information on various swaps. I'm doing a 3.4 V-6/T-5 on my GT and have written a small description of what I went through just on getting the eingine to run on a test stand. It's in my journal under Phase I. RallyBob is right on a lot of things you will be the initiator on, I was lucky in that others have done the mod I'm attempting and I have their experience to go by. I spent about 2-3 weeks checking out the engine computer and sensors to make sure all connections were good and functional before I got to even try starting the engine. There should be logical steps to the mod. I would think first off, will the engine fit and what tranny will work. If the engine will fit, you'll have to make up new motor mounts and tranny mounts. You may want to look at Phase II of my mod in the download section, it will give you a starting place for the engine/tranny crossmembers. I don't know how much fuel pressure your new engine will need but if it's below 70 psi the fuel pump I'm using should suffice. There are a lot of things as Bob stated that need to be considered, everything I've done so far may help or may not apply in your circumstances, but a little may work out for you. If what I've done can be of help, great. Also if you have any questions, I'll be glad to help you out with what I've done so far. One thing, don't plan on this taking a weekend or two to get done, I've been working on my mod over a year almost daily and put in over $3000 in parts. You can't go for second best parts in a mod of this type, go first class, or don't even attempt it, you'll be disappointed and have to spend more time and money to redo what doesn't last very long. Just my $.02
Ron
Ron
V6 transplant
I can say from experience also that when you start a project like this it can take a long long time to complete. I started my project 4 years ago and I'm finally nearing the completion. All I have left is the carpet, seats, and wiring for the lights up front. Otherwise the paint is on and the V6 engine is in and running!!! Also, I find it hard to believe but I have spent pretty close to $10,000 on my car. I know when I'm on the road every penny will be worth it! I would like to get some more pics posted but I can't seem to get under the photo size. Well good luck in whatever you decide.
I can say from experience also that when you start a project like this it can take a long long time to complete. I started my project 4 years ago and I'm finally nearing the completion. All I have left is the carpet, seats, and wiring for the lights up front. Otherwise the paint is on and the V6 engine is in and running!!! Also, I find it hard to believe but I have spent pretty close to $10,000 on my car. I know when I'm on the road every penny will be worth it! I would like to get some more pics posted but I can't seem to get under the photo size. Well good luck in whatever you decide.
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Re: V6 transplant
There is a link to a free photo editor in the Downloads section. Or you could upload them to your album in the Photo Gallery and the program will take care of the resizing. Once in your gallery, add a link to your post.jyoung171 said:
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Here's another thought on the Ecotec transplant. Why not take the entire Saturn front suspension/engine/transaxle, and transplant it in the rear of the GT? A mid-engined, rear wheel drive Opel.....
You could remove the rear axle and lower floor, and create a cradle/subframe that bolts from beneath, holding the entire engine/tranny/suspension assembly. Maybe hinge the 'trunk lid' area for normal engine maintenance.
Sort of a 'MR-GT'.
Bob
You could remove the rear axle and lower floor, and create a cradle/subframe that bolts from beneath, holding the entire engine/tranny/suspension assembly. Maybe hinge the 'trunk lid' area for normal engine maintenance.
Sort of a 'MR-GT'.
Bob
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No problem with rear steering. You eliminate the rack and pinion, and use tie-rods that mount to the OEM steering arms, and to stationary inner points. Toe can be adjusted with the tie-rods.
GM did this with the Fiero, they used a Chevy Citation front suspension, and just put it in the rear of the Fiero, minus the steering rack.
Cooling....use radiator in the front of the car, and run aluminum tubes from front to rear inside the now unused tranny tunnel, connected by rubber hoses.
Most modern cars use cable shifters for the tranny. This should be fairly easily adapted with a longer cables. If it is mechanical (I don't know which type the Saturn uses), then you'd have to relocate and extend the mechanical linkage. All in all, probably a day's planning and another day or two to build the shifter linkage.
Bob
GM did this with the Fiero, they used a Chevy Citation front suspension, and just put it in the rear of the Fiero, minus the steering rack.
Cooling....use radiator in the front of the car, and run aluminum tubes from front to rear inside the now unused tranny tunnel, connected by rubber hoses.
Most modern cars use cable shifters for the tranny. This should be fairly easily adapted with a longer cables. If it is mechanical (I don't know which type the Saturn uses), then you'd have to relocate and extend the mechanical linkage. All in all, probably a day's planning and another day or two to build the shifter linkage.
Bob
this plan somehow seems a lot easier that converting the engine to RWD from the front. I would have to add some weight to the front of the car though. I know that the gas tank would add some weight, but that will change as I am driving it.
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if you still want to go the front engine(ecotec) rear wheel format you could look for opel omega running gear on evil bay as opel have done all the hard work. you would then only have the normal work to do on the drivetrain.
it would cost to ship but would save the work in trying to get the weight balance back if you went the mid engine route
ive added the specs for the omega just incase you want them
(opens with acrobat)
it would cost to ship but would save the work in trying to get the weight balance back if you went the mid engine route
ive added the specs for the omega just incase you want them
(opens with acrobat)
ok first the HURST Hairy OLds was a oldsmobile torandado with a 455 in the front and in the rear that was very very dangerous because it had lockers front and rear and so 4 spinning wheels dont tend to make a car very controlable
and so that would be very crazy to put that kind of setup in an opel gt
next scoobie sland term for subaru and by subaru i mean an all wheel drive drivetrain including their engine in a opel gt make for an awesome ride that will handle great
and so that would be very crazy to put that kind of setup in an opel gt
next scoobie sland term for subaru and by subaru i mean an all wheel drive drivetrain including their engine in a opel gt make for an awesome ride that will handle great
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I have a WRX. Believe me, they don't handle that well. I'll take a Manta any day over my Subaru. But, the WRX suspension is very compliant and good over the rough stuff.
Besides, the struts on the Subaru are so long, they would protrude through a GT hood by about 5", that, and the suspension track is around 10" wider, assuming you utilize the OEM Subaru wheels which have an extremely high offset (53 mm). You'd need HUGE flares. The engine is also very wide, being a boxer, so you'd have to clip the front of the GT off completely and tube it, it won't fit between the GT framerails.
Bob
Besides, the struts on the Subaru are so long, they would protrude through a GT hood by about 5", that, and the suspension track is around 10" wider, assuming you utilize the OEM Subaru wheels which have an extremely high offset (53 mm). You'd need HUGE flares. The engine is also very wide, being a boxer, so you'd have to clip the front of the GT off completely and tube it, it won't fit between the GT framerails.
Bob
Hey Josh, my other car is a 79 Alfa Gt. Drivetrain is very unique, front eng. DOHC all alum 2.0L, mechanical fuel injection and a live driveshaft feeding the clutch and transaxle(1 unit) located in the rear with racing suspension and inboard disc brakes. Cars balance is 50/50 from the factory. Now to get this in an opel.....
DAN
DAN
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Nice car! My friend John used to have a '79 Alfa GTV with the 2.0, Spica injection, and an aftermarket turbo. FAAAAAAST! That was the first turbo car I messed with, I was amazed at how litttle things made a big difference in power with a turbo setup. Problem is, it shredded driveshaft rubber connector joints, and broke two transaxles, plus broke a set of flywheel bolts....too much torque. It was designed for 125 hp, not 250+!
But it was probably the best handling OEM car I've ever driven (yes, better than an Opel), with awesome brake response as well.
Wow, flashback to the '80's for me.....
Bob
But it was probably the best handling OEM car I've ever driven (yes, better than an Opel), with awesome brake response as well.
Wow, flashback to the '80's for me.....
Bob
ok well lets get back to the ecotec
i think the new ones like in the cavalier have the same bellhousing as the old engine but i dk i might be wrong because there in a new gm trans at work for a small fwd car like cavalier with an odd bolt pattern and i havent looked at the new ecotec yet
that being said if it has the old style 4 cyl bellhousing like the 60 degree v6 and the s10 4 cyl the you could get a ecotec for a manual trans and put it in there longitudianaly
wow i cant spell
the next prob is motor mounts
its a project to do hell someone figured out how to mount a north star this way which would be cool in a gt
light powerful and there would really be no room on either side of the engine
i think the new ones like in the cavalier have the same bellhousing as the old engine but i dk i might be wrong because there in a new gm trans at work for a small fwd car like cavalier with an odd bolt pattern and i havent looked at the new ecotec yet
that being said if it has the old style 4 cyl bellhousing like the 60 degree v6 and the s10 4 cyl the you could get a ecotec for a manual trans and put it in there longitudianaly
wow i cant spell
the next prob is motor mounts
its a project to do hell someone figured out how to mount a north star this way which would be cool in a gt
light powerful and there would really be no room on either side of the engine
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