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My 944 exhaust (with catalytic converter) gives off a stinky sulphurous odor when you stand behind it, as many cars do, but you do not smell it inside of the car normally while going down the road. It does not smoke, but it does have an onerous smell.
However, when I have the rear side of the sunroof tilted open and I am decelerating in any gear, that noxious smell is drawn into the car through the sunroof. I think that the low pressure area created around the rear of the car and the wing, along with the deceleration, helps to draw the exhaust odor into the open sunroof.
By extension, it seems like exhaust odor could also be drawn in through the side or rear windows of the GT under these conditions as well. Does your problem exist with windows open or closed?
 

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Discussion Starter #42 (Edited)
My 944 exhaust (with catalytic converter) gives off a stinky sulphurous odor when you stand behind it, as many cars do, but you do not smell it inside of the car normally while going down the road. It does not smoke, but it does have an onerous smell.
However, when I have the rear side of the sunroof tilted open and I am decelerating in any gear, that noxious smell is drawn into the car through the sunroof. I think that the low pressure area created around the rear of the car and the wing, along with the deceleration, helps to draw the exhaust odor into the open sunroof.
By extension, it seems like exhaust odor could also be drawn in through the side or rear windows of the GT under these conditions as well. Does your problem exist with windows open or closed?
It’s like night & day windows open I get the smell in the car, windows closed absolutely nothing at all!
The worst for me is when my drivers side window is open.
 

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Opel Rallier since 1977
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OK... that 'splains that.... living in SoCal where you can have the windows open a lot! So not any issue in particular with it just being a matter of odd airflow.

As for it being the valve seals..... Part of this conclusion is the statement that you wife only say this from the exhaust pipe. That indicates inside the combustion chamber engine and very probably not excess pressure in the crankcase. If it was, then your wife ought to have seen smoke coming from under the car in general, not only out of the tailpipe, and the smoke would be mostly or only under hard acceleration. The gunk on your valves helps to point to the seals.

BTW, I just modded my HFT leak tester to have the proper orifice. The only hard part was drilling the .040" hole in the orifice. I'll do a leakdown on a 2k miles 225 /6 rebuild to see what I see.

I'll post on the tool use shortly.
 

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Just Some Dude in Jersey
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There definitely are ways that smells from the outside of the car and the exhaust and fuel tank area can somehow waft around the outside of the car and into the windows. I spent quite some time chasing a fuel tank venting problem that would happen after I filled my fuel tank. You couldn't smell it with the windows up, but roll them down and cruise around and I would suddenly smell fresh gas at odd times, then nothing, then back again. I was venting out my left rear wheel well, apparently, occasionally the fuel vapors would blow in my always open windows. I put an air restricter in the line and fixed the problem. When I was running super rich to keep my Red Baron's worn out 2.0 running, I would frequently experience my eyes burning from my too rich exhaust emanations. Just driving down the road at, say, 40-50mph, I'd smell my rich exhaust. But windows up: Nothing.
 

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Opel Rallier since 1977
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TC, that tool is just a lever that uses the rocker stud as the fulcrum point.

Basic procedure:
- Put 1-2' of small rope in the cylinder and bring up the piston to near TDC, to hold the valves
- Remove the rocker
- Get a socket about 3/4" size. Invert the socket with the mouth down and centered on the retainer, and then smack the socket against the retainer with a hammer. This breaks the keepers loose. (They won't fly out but need to be loosened up.)
- Place the stud in the hole in the tool, and put the stud nut back on a run it down so that most of the threads are engaged. Or get a couple of nuts with the same threading as the stud and use that.
- Then the 'fork' on the end of the tool ought to be in position to press down on the retainer and spring with enough space to let the valve stem come up through, so you can grab the keepers with needle nose pliers or similar. Then relax the lever to let the spring come back up.
- Reverse to re-assemble after the seal has been replaced.

I've attached a photo of that lever held in place so you can get the idea. Again, this is angled for use on a V8 so will be a bit awkward on an I4. It could be bent and reinforced at a better angle.
 

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Discussion Starter #46 (Edited)
TC, that tool is just a lever that uses the rocker stud as the fulcrum point.

Basic procedure:
- Put 1-2' of small rope in the cylinder and bring up the piston to near TDC, to hold the valves
- Remove the rocker
- Get a socket about 3/4" size. Invert the socket with the mouth down and centered on the retainer, and then smack the socket against the retainer with a hammer. This breaks the keepers loose. (They won't fly out but need to be loosened up.)
- Place the stud in the hole in the tool, and put the stud nut back on a run it down so that most of the threads are engaged. Or get a couple of nuts with the same threading as the stud and use that.
- Then the 'fork' on the end of the tool ought to be in position to press down on the retainer and spring with enough space to let the valve stem come up through, so you can grab the keepers with needle nose pliers or similar. Then relax the lever to let the spring come back up.
- Reverse to re-assemble after the seal has been replaced.

I've attached a photo of that lever held in place so you can get the idea. Again, this is angled for use on a V8 so will be a bit awkward on an I4. It could be bent and reinforced at a better angle.
E-gads, all looks good for 1, 2 & probably #3. Remember I have the GT and the #4 looks like it’s tucked under the windshield wiper motor or would that be the cowl? I’m still learning what the certain parts of the car are called. That one makes me laugh thanks to Harold.

Any thoughts on getting at the #4? Maybe I’ll hear back from guyopel. He said that he had several tools that he uses.

I have a better cylinder head waiting to get rebuilt properly this time even if I have to drive it up to Gils shop.
The only doom & gloom as Gordo mentions here would be if I had bad rings. All indicators are they’re fine. I suppose I might want to go through the leakdown procedure to prove that. So that subject isn’t closed yet by any means. Let’s see as you said, if the seals are doable first. Does anyone have any suggestions or experience on the #4?

Oh, and thank you very much for the detailed directions. I did order the tool earlier today btw.
 

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Opel Rallier since 1977
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Does anyone have any suggestions or experience on the #4
Oh yeah.... that pesky GT construction. Dunno if you have enough room to flip the toll over and have the handle sticking down towards the starter..... Boy, I sure like my 50 series cars!

And since this is a small job, yes, just do it IMHO. The oil in the backs of the valves says it is worthwhile.

Here is a coupla pix of the orifice for the HFT leakdown tool. I just drilled it in a short piece of 1/4-20 all-thread.... Started with a 3/16" bit for a lead in bevel to the orifice.... then had to use a pin vice to hold the tiny .040" (#60) drill bit and put the pin vice in a hand drill. Took a very slow speed to cut a decent chip. Then the inlet of the LD device was tapped for 1/4-20 threads and the orifice inserted. Moved the inlet gauge to the outlet (cylinder side), and will plug the old inlet gauge hole and adapt this to feed from my nailgun compressor, and run at 80 psi.
 

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This is the tool I have used and I did a simple layout to show you how it works and the seals that you would need (the oil ring in the valve spring cap is easy to damage ) there are tricks to help on number 4 . Remove the engine mounts , the radiator fan shroud to drop the engine down so tool will clear.
First I would start with number one cylinder to see what you have .. loose fitting, missing or cut or damaged valve seal and or missing or cut o-ring seal and post photos so I can advise you on next step. You really only need to look at intake seals at this time.
Sorry for the late reply i am working on a 16V engine for someone here in GA... i hope he is not reading this ......LOL
The last two photos are from his engine.
John
 

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The tool number is in the photo, it's a J-tool that I bought from the GM tool site while I worked at GM dealers. It was best to order your own J-tools because the shop tools were broken or damaged (this tool can be used in the press--right?) so I always had what I needed.
Tool # is J-26513 I have seen a tool close to this design that has a knob on top.
 

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(this tool can be used in the press--right?)
This part made me laugh!! LOL
Tnx, I did find one on ebay under the tool number. This is a lot better than the new ones.... and you could put a shorter grade 8 bolt in it for tight spaces.
 

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Discussion Starter #53 (Edited)
Spring removal tools

That’s a typical Wonderbar, what a great idea! I measured the distance from the back of the head to the #4 intake and it’s a little over 4”. Depending on the angle with the way the cowl goes in towards the windshield right over the valve cover I might just have a good enough angle with this sort of tool, very similar to the KD912. I won’t be seeing the 912 until next week.

A thought I had with the home made bar, a cut grove where the bar meets the cowl if necessary might work too. I’d rather not lower the engine IF I can get away with it. For those who wonder, why not just pull the head, it’s because I had to install a $150 MLS head gasket for piston clearance reasons.

I’ll definitely get pictures of the seal areas with the springs off, I will double check the measurements of the guide etc. as well. I have the 4 Victor Rienz intake seals that came with the head gasket set. I intend on replacing the seals with those. Thank you again for the help so far.
 

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That’s a typical Wonderbar, what a great idea! I measured the distance from the back of the head to the #4 intake and it’s a little over 4”. Depending on the angle with the way the cowl goes in towards the windshield right over the valve cover I might just have a good enough angle with this sort of tool, very similar to the KD912.
I accessed one of the rear valves, don't remember if I was able to get to both, by flipping the tool over. It's tight back there!

Harold
 

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...Sorry for the late reply i am working on a 16V engine for someone here in GA... i hope he is not reading this ......LOL
The last two photos are from his engine.
John
It is his fault if he is!

Back on topic;
I have not read all the posts so apologies if this has been answered but I have a couple of DAQ's (dumb ass questions).
Is the large hose from the valve cover going to the air intake?
Is the small valve cover hose going to the metered orifice under the carb and is that orifice clear?
Is the mesh filter in the valve cover clean?

That is basically the C.I.H PCV system and if any of those are not working properly, you will get over pressurization of the crankcase and get blow by out the point of least resistance. (Dipstick, valve cover gasket, oil filler cap, etc.)
 

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Discussion Starter #57
It is his fault if he is!

Back on topic;
I have not read all the posts so apologies if this has been answered but I have a couple of DAQ's (dumb ass questions).
Is the large hose from the valve cover going to the air intake?
Is the small valve cover hose going to the metered orifice under the carb and is that orifice clear?
Is the mesh filter in the valve cover clean?

That is basically the C.I.H PCV system and if any of those are not working properly, you will get over pressurization of the crankcase and get blow by out the point of least resistance. (Dipstick, valve cover gasket, oil filler cap, etc.)
Nothing wrong with those questions, it’s a good summary of what trips a lot of us up:

1) Large hose going into an oil catch can with a “Chore Boy” copper screen mesh, the outlet then connects to the 1/2” Elbow on my Weber box filter.

2) The small hose from the valve cover going to the 1mm, maybe too small? Metered orfice on the intake manifold.
I don’t know what the factory spec is on that? I soldered up the fitting that looks like it was for the automatic transmission (1/8” or so) and drilled the 1mm hole for the valve cover. It is currently pulling a vacuum and I try to keep an eye on it periodically.

3) When I did the 2.0 conversion I removed the old steel mesh, cleaned everything up and installed the same copper mesh mentioned above. I couldn’t imagine it being restricted yet.

The only thing that I might play around with after I get a handle on the oil control problem at the valves, would be the orfice size for the small hole, maybe another .5mm larger?

Thank you for the input.
 

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Discussion Starter #58
I had time today to replace the valve seals on the intakes. I installed the Victor Reinz stock including the dreaded #4. I cut about an inch off the handle end and inverted the KD912 thank you again Harold. It worked quite well. I used the rope method and followed the steps thanks again MR for taking the time earlier on this post to write a step by step. Everything went smoothly.

The most difficult thing was removing the 11/32” seals. I used a custom made paint can opener to dig underneath the bottom and pry up until I could wiggle them out. Maybe they make a special tool? I immediately gave up when on my first try using a pair of Chanel Locks it wasn’t going anywhere, I didn’t want to chance damaging the valve stem. Got’em all with the tool. Man they were very tight around the valve guides, I couldn’t find anything else wrong with them visually other than being the incorrect size. I can only post so many pictures but have more and saved the old seals.

I’m posting a few of the better pics I got, I also took a small movie wiggling the valve stem, it didn’t move much but it’s available if requested. The only thing I forgot to do was to measure the OD of the stem & guide. They were purchased new as mentioned earlier. I can always check it later if my problem doesn’t go away. Now I need to keep my fingers crossed and put some drive time behind the wheel.
 

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Why spoil your victory by chasing a (possible) problem that seems to have no effect on the car? You don't go through oil, now you won't smell it anymore, so, so what if you have a little wind coming out of your engine? I put 225K+ on my previous 2.0 and a nice strong breeze came out of the valve cover the whole time. It didn't affect a thing.

Sleep well tonight, safe in the thought that the normal, musty, dank, stank of your rotting interior will no longer be intruded upon by the dank, musty, stank of your stinky engine oil.

:veryhappy
Yeah try to ride with me to the Nationals LOL, no telling what will happen when I get my crippled old butt to Carlisle. I'll be happier than a pig in mud. Might see what is going on in the bottoms,I may try to get some pictures of my "Toy". Glad you got it solved Tom. Take Care, Jarrell
 

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Opel Rallier since 1977
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So TC, you say the seals were not the right ID for the stems? The seals you have are probably a standard size over the guide boss, so you might be able to find the correct stem ID if you like. But for street/cruiser engines, standard seals are often a good choice. With the guide boss turned down in diameter, I'll be interested to hear how well those stock seals work for you.

Teflon seals are a bit too good, and can starve the guides and stems of oil and you can end up with excess guide wear. So if you go back to the style you took out, see if you can find them made of Viton....which may be what you had in there.

Good deal on the tool mod!

Chanigng valve stem seals was the first 'inside-the-motor' job that I ever did.... on my Ford Ranchero's 302 way back in '74. They were only 4 years old and had only 75k miles on them, but they were already hardened up some and leaking a bit down the guides.
 
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