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Opeler
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Discussion Starter #1
I did a search but could not find any direct threads on this topic. I'm interested in converting to a waste-spark DIS using something like the old Ford EDIS-4 system. Seems many vintage guys have done this using ECUs of various brands. Advantages are electronic timing both advance and retard, no external vacuum lines or potential leaks, much higher spark efficiency (no dizzy losses), no moving parts other than the crank wheel obviously. Anyone play around with these?
 

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MarkandSon aka Jeff has some info on the edis system.
Hey Dan,
In the original Ford EDIS system what was the computer that the EDIS module was connected to in order to produce the timing signals? Seems like if you were able to adapt that computer to be used in an Opel with a non modified engine it might work.
 

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Opeler
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Discussion Starter #7
Hey Dan,
In the original Ford EDIS system what was the computer that the EDIS module was connected to in order to produce the timing signals? Seems like if you were able to adapt that computer to be used in an Opel with a non modified engine it might work.
I had the same question. Was it one of the Ford EEC computers? I've also seen the Megajolt aftermarket computer. Both that one and the Megasquirt cost around $200 from what I can tell.
 

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I had the same question. Was it one of the Ford EEC computers? I've also seen the Megajolt aftermarket computer. Both that one and the Megasquirt cost around $200 from what I can tell.
Also in your case since you have a 6 cylinder you would need the EDIS6 module and your trigger wheel would be timed differently than for a 4 cylinder. The missing tooth would be timed 60 degrees before TDC for the EDIS6 and it is at 90 degrees for the EDIS4
 

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Opeler
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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Also in your case since you have a 6 cylinder you would need the EDIS6 module and your trigger wheel would be timed differently than for a 4 cylinder. The missing tooth would be timed 60 degrees before TDC for the EDIS6 and it is at 90 degrees for the EDIS4
Hah, thanks for thinking of the V6 opel Mark! But actually I was thinking of doing this on the new Opel I4 engine I'm eventually getting from Charles for my yellow 70 GT.

So I did read up some and learned that the electronic timing function can operated via a MAP sensor (built into the megajolt system) or via a TPS sensor. I would assume the logic would also have to know the current rpms to map the right timing.
 
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Hah, thanks for thinking of the V6 opel Mark! But actually I was thinking of doing this on the new Opel I4 engine I'm eventually getting from Charles for my yellow 70 GT.

So I did read up some and learned that the electronic timing function can operated via a MAP sensor (built into the megajolt system) or via a TPS sensor. I would assume the logic would also have to know the current rpms to map the right timing.
That does not make sense to me. The MAP reading has to do with engine load not timing and the TPS is throttle opening. I thing you are confusing a couple of parameters or reading something that has to do with fuel delivery rather than spark timing.
 

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I had the same question. Was it one of the Ford EEC computers? I've also seen the Megajolt aftermarket computer. Both that one and the Megasquirt cost around $200 from what I can tell.
They moved the edis module to internal starting with the eec-v pcm.
 

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The units where setup with the future in mind.
For example my firing order is 1-3-4-2-1-3-4-2-1-3

That's right even the eec-iv was able to handle a ten cylinder powerplant back in the early '90's.
You just had to turn it on/off so to speak.
 

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Opeler
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Discussion Starter #13
That does not make sense to me. The MAP reading has to do with engine load not timing and the TPS is throttle opening. I thing you are confusing a couple of parameters or reading something that has to do with fuel delivery rather than spark timing.
Jeff, ALl I know is what I read on the website: https://wiki.autosportlabs.com/MegaJolt_Lite_Jr. and https://wiki.autosportlabs.com/Choosing_between_MAP_or_TPS

I'm assuming from a logic perspective that if you know your current rpm and the throttle position is greater than what is expected from say a pre-programmed timing map that one could assume the engine to be under load and thus adjust timing advance would be the thing to do. I'm not an ignition expert so just trying to understand how that particular system may work. Albeit it may be a crude method based on modern technology but apparently well enough for the times.
 

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...

I'm assuming from a logic perspective that if you know your current rpm and the throttle position is greater than what is expected from say a pre-programmed timing map that one could assume the engine to be under load and thus adjust timing advance would be the thing to do....
This is where you start blending the the spark map's together to suit your needs.
One is rpm (alpha-n) vs load vs manifold psi...this all depends if your using absolute manifold pressure????

But alas there is no fear I'm sure that firstopel will reply soon to cut me down.
 

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Opeler
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Discussion Starter #15
If one assumed to maintain the current distributor vacuum advance/retard mechanisms then all you would need for a DIS would be be either two (waste spark) or four (coil on plug) outputs from the dizzy cam per rotation. With the popular Pertronix it obviously outputs the signal once per lobe or 4 times a rotation....same as the old points did. So I wonder if anyone has designed something like the Pertronix that would output two trigger signals 180 degrees apart? With that setup you could run the waste spark DIS on the 4-cyl engines.
 

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If one assumed to maintain the current distributor vacuum advance/retard mechanisms then all you would need for a DIS would be be either two (waste spark) or four (coil on plug) outputs from the dizzy cam per rotation.
Distributorless Ignition System (DIS)?
With the popular Pertronix it obviously outputs the signal once per lobe or 4 times a rotation....same as the old points did. So I wonder if anyone has designed something like the Pertronix that would output two trigger signals 180 degrees apart? With that setup you could run the waste spark DIS on the 4-cyl engines.
Is there a performance or emissions advantage to the wasted spark system? All I found was that it was simpler to program.

Harold
 

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The dizzy shaft is needed to drive the CIH oil pump, not to say that you can't short it down a bit tho.
Or use the left over area for a cam sensor......
 

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Distributorless Ignition System (DIS)?
Is there a performance or emissions advantage to the wasted spark system? All I found was that it was simpler to program.

Harold
Yes, DIS = distributorless ignition system.

With wasted spark you don't need a cam position sensor, only a crank position sensor so yes, from that standpoint it is easier to program.
 

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Yes, DIS = distributorless ignition system.

With wasted spark you don't need a cam position sensor, only a crank position sensor so yes, from that standpoint it is easier to program.
The edis module is pretty smart.
Cranking rpm is ~150rpm
Faster with a natural magnet starter.
Anyway once a threshold rpm has been met(it counts the angle rates)it knows which cylinder that has fired.
So no the edis module does not need a cam sensor to sync the injectors.

If you want to go with a COP system you'll need 2 edis

Don't have a clue with a ion spark setup.:)
 
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