Opel GT Forum banner
1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Old Opeler
Joined
·
5,564 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
A new cam and lifters arrived from the UK today - they were supsosed to be for a 2.0 Vauxhall Carlton or Cavalier CIH motor but there has been a SNAFU and a cam kit one number back in the listing arrived instead....

The interesting thing is that the lifters with the kit are the same diameter and height as Opel CIH ones plus generally similar in over all dimensions. The one significant difference is that instead of the spherical seat for the Opel "push rod" that is attached to the rocker, the top is flat and obviously made to contat with a roller of some sort.

The cam kit is made by Moprod (a division of Quinton Hazzel) and has Kit Number MOC118 on the packet. The problem is because it has been sent in error I have no idea what motor it fits. There are some pictures attached that may help someone identify the cam for me. Please!
 

Attachments

·
boomerang opeler
Joined
·
5,670 Posts
sorry to question your reading jim but are you sure its Moprod as i dont think they make cam kits !!

they look like the cam in a ford CVH and the cam followers look to be escort /fiesta
i will have a root about for 1 to post a pic of
 

·
Old Opeler
Joined
·
5,564 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Yes!

baz said:
would the follower look like this ?
Exactly, Baz

I have found the Moprod listings on the Quinton Hazel site www2.qha.com
and the MOC118 kit is for a 1.4/1.6 Ford Festiva.
I have been sent MOC118 instead of MOC119 (which is for a 2.0 Vauxhall Carlton CIH motor).
Sometimes the strangest co-incidences bring us good info!

Moprod seems to be the Retail Specialist arm of Quinton Hazel.

Here is a pic of the box the kit came in:
 

Attachments

·
Old Opeler
Joined
·
5,564 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Bigger!

The Festiva lifter is 0.875" in diameter while the Opel CIH is 0.841" however the heights are almost identical. The Oil system grooves in the outer diameter are somewhat different too. Worth a bit more investigation though.....
In the pic. Festiva lifter on left and Opel CIH on the right.
 

Attachments

·
Old Opeler
Joined
·
5,564 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Better!

Anti-pump up. It gets better and better.

I guess there will be a bit learned about the way Opel hydraulic lifters meter the oil to the rocker studs for lubing the rockers before this is a success .......
 

·
boomerang opeler
Joined
·
5,670 Posts
GTJIM said:
Anti-pump up. It gets better and better.

I guess there will be a bit learned about the way Opel hydraulic lifters meter the oil to the rocker studs for lubing the rockers before this is a success .......
i think it works like most other systems and passes by the lifter as the groove lines up with the 2 holes
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
521 Posts
Rocker spacer??

ok, it's been awhile since I had the rockers off, let alone the roller rockers ON (never)

Can anyone tell me what these are for? I have a 2.2 head and some of these "spacers" were on the rocker studs and some wern't. What are they used for and do I need them for the roller rockers? The rockers seem to fit better w/o them. i.e. they'll rest directly on the spring and lifter and not touch the bottom of the stud.

Oh, and I'm using a cam from OGTS. NOT a roller cam..... tha'ts not a problem is it? (solid lifters)
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
521 Posts
thanks Travis..so the roller rocker never touches the bottom of the stud in the center?

When I tighten the rockers down, is the polylock the only thing needed?

I don't need to use the original rocker nut and then the polylock on top of that? (I was reading part of a thread on this.)

And I adjust with the valves (lifter all the way down) in the closed position right?


thanks again, sorry for the shotgun of questions... :eek:
 

·
Senior Contributor
Joined
·
903 Posts
Yes, just the rocker and the poly-lock. And yes, adjust wih the valve closed. I reccomend using a motorcycle feeler gauge or other small feeler gauge that will fit between the lips on the valve end of the rocker. It's better to measure on this side, than the lifter side

-Travis
 

·
Old Opeler
Joined
·
5,564 Posts
Different!

Travis said:
Yes, just the rocker and the poly-lock. And yes, adjust wih the valve closed. I reccomend using a motorcycle feeler gauge or other small feeler gauge that will fit between the lips on the valve end of the rocker. It's better to measure on this side, than the lifter side-
Travis
Because of the rocker ratio of near 1.5:1 the clearance between the lifter cap and the short end roller will be only 2/3rds of the clearance betweenthe valve tip and the long end roller. So it is possible to gap at the lifter end BUT the feeler gauge needs to be 0.008" to give 0.012" clearance at the valve tip.
Try it and confirm!
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
14,872 Posts
Jim, I helped Samdog with the installation instructions for the roller rockers, and I put that notation in the instructions since not everyone has access to narrow feeler gauges. In the case of the roller rockers, the ratio is closer to 1.557:1, so you'd divide the cam grinder's lash specification by the rocker ratio to get the clearance value at the lifter side.

Example: .018" clearance for a performance cam, as measured at valve end.
Divide by 1.557, new clearance at lifter end will be .01155", but you can round up to .012".

HTH,
Bob
 

·
Senior Contributor
Joined
·
903 Posts
GTJIM said:
Because of the rocker ratio of near 1.5:1 the clearance between the lifter cap and the short end roller will be only 2/3rds of the clearance betweenthe valve tip and the long end roller. So it is possible to gap at the lifter end BUT the feeler gauge needs to be 0.008" to give 0.012" clearance at the valve tip.
Try it and confirm!
That's the method I used before I bought the smaller feeler guages. I now prefer not to do it that way as the error in the measuring process gets multiplied by the rocker ratio(1.557, I believe). Between this amplification(56%) of the error and the rocker ratio not actually being 1.5:1 you quickly end up with a gap that's different then what you thought it was. Is it enough difference to make a difference, I'm not qualified to say. But if you can do it right, why not...

-Travis
 

·
Old Opeler
Joined
·
5,564 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
By Measurement

My apologies for being so imprecise ......

By actual measurement on one of my roller rockers the short side centre to centre length is 25.475mm (1.003") and the long side c to c is 39.475mm (1.554") so the actual ratio of this particular rocker is 1.5496:1 approximately on the rounded metric measurement or 1.54935 approximately on the rounded inch measurement......

So an 0.012" gap at the valve tip would be a 0.0077439" gap at the lifter cap end on the rounded metric measurement or 0.0077451" on the rounded inch measurement ........ er! about 0.008"

That of course only applies to the actual rocker that was measured with the Inspection Department equipment where I work. Fortunately the three centres involved appear to lie along the same line or else angularity would have had to be factored into the ratio computation. :p
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
14,872 Posts
Jim, my methodology for determining the ratio was a bit different. I measured the ratio on an actual engine mockup. Using a solid lifter with zero clearance, I used a known camshaft and measured the lift at the lifter with a dial indicator. I then fitted a rocker arm and measured the valve opening with the dial indicator. The 1.557:1 ratio was averaged out, the only real variation being on full-race cams with smaller base circles, where the rocker inclination angle reduced the effective ratio by way of the contact patch on the lifter top. So I found that for racing cams, using a taller lifter (1mm) gained back the 'lost' valve lift and returned the rocker ratio to 'normal'. Hope that makes sense?

Hydraulic lifters are another story altogether, they make the rocker arm ratio variable while running!

Bob
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top