[Bosco2]

I just got ANOTHER pan gasket set (1973 steel pan) because I messed up my last one. I used RTV on the entire gasket (not just where the cork and rubber meet) and because it's slippery my cork gasket squeezed out at some of the bolts and tore....way before I got to 5 ft/lbs. I was wondering how people do this successfully......I don't want to put the gasket on dry, would rather use RTV or something similar to seal it better, if possible.

Thanks

 

[greensmurf20]

you may laugh, but here is what i do, pans haven't leaked on the 2 motors i did this way.

3M super weather stripping adhesive on the block all the way down the sides and around the bolt holes, but DONT use it where the rubber parts go.

stick the gasket up there until it sticks and then put your rubbers in, and use RTV were rubber meets cork, and then just put your pan up there without sealer on the pan side of the gasket.

 

[GTJIM (R.I.P.)]

Spare the RTV!

Good one Greensmurf20

Too much RTV is worse than none!

If it gets into the oil ways then the motor is doomed.

There are much better proucts such as "Hylomar" - used by Rolls Royce and some Loctite (TM) instant gasket products.

 

[jordan]

I actually stuck the gaskets onto the block with super glue.

 

[oldopelguy]

yuck

This is an easy one:
The holes in the cork are a tight fit for the bolts. Insert all of the bolts through the pan into the gasket before putting it up to the motor. The bolts hold the gasket and the gasket holds the bolts. Add a dab of RTV at the corners and you're golden.

This works if you have to use a cork valve cover gasket too.

 

[bear]

Two gasket sealers I swear by. Permatex Form-A-Gasket and Gaskacinch. I used the latter on my racing bikes and never had a gasket come apart while removing it at the end of the racing season when I tore down the engines. JMTCW.

Ron

 

[Bosco2]

so Ron.......

I've always liked Form-A-Gasket #2......wondering how it would work for the oil pan gasket.....??? Have you used it for that?

 

[bear]

To be honest I haven't had the need to take off an oil pan in years, but I've used it on numerous water pumps and never had a problem with leaks after using it. That and the gaskets usually came off with minimal scraper at the sealing surfaces. Another thing I'm anal about is using anti-sieze compound (MIL-T-555) on all engine bolts. I've had to drill out and rethread too many holes where it wasn't used, especially on water pumps. Thank God for Dremels.

Ron

 

[Bosco2]

i always use it on water pumps too........and i just used it on the transmission pan. just wondering how it would work on a larger piece......not alot of people seem to use it.

 

[GTJIM (R.I.P.)]

Yeah! Nice, expensive Loctite (TM) Nickel antisieze as it looks better on alloy parts and lasts better than that copper stuff!
Also use stainless bolts or cap screws when ever the size I need is available and actually turn down the shank between the thread and the head for water pump bolts to make removal easier.

Eliminating "pains in the butt" is NOT being anal

 

[bear]

Jim, the anti-sieze compound I use is for putting spark plugs in aluminum air-cooled aircraft engines. It has a high carbon-graphite base so there is a path for electron flow for the spark plugs. Correct torque is essential in this application, too much and you ruin a cylinder, which has the head as an integral part. I was told one time that stainless steel hardware was a little softer than what we classify here as Grade 8 hardware. So I always go with the Grade 8 and use the compound on everything, except head bolts. I clean them real good and use a little oil on the threads as the manuals dictate. It's an Air Force thing, seen too many reports of the wrong hardware causing accidents and loss of life. That's easy to understand if you realize there are no curbs or taxicabs at 30,000 feet. Or on another aircraft I was crew chief on that flew above 80,000 feet, in excess of 2100 MPH.

Ron

 

[GTJIM (R.I.P.)]

Grade 8

That aeronautical spark plug antisieze bares investigation as I have been using a smear of oil from the dipstick on the threads of the plugs in my Rover's alloy heads for years - with mixed results.

Work in the Marine industry myself and we have mostly metric fasteners ( though I was trained in dual measuring systems and recognise "grade 8" from US automotive terminology). We use ungraded; grade 8.8 and grade 12.9 metric thread stainless cap screws. There are no taxis in mid-ocean either!

We have had a couple of catastrophic failures with machine tool boring bars where the operators have replaced high grade 'black' steel cap screws with ungraded stainless ones. I was amazed to find that few tradesmen on site had any knowledge of "grades" of fastners and that wholesale use of ungraded stainless fastners was the norm

When a boring bar spinning at 6,000 revs comes apart it brings the lesson home - quickly! Fortunately no one was injured.

 

[bear]

Jim, horror stories abound about using the wrong hardware in almost all industries. It is scary. The can of antisieze compound I've been using, I've had for over 20 years, it doesn't take more than stick a bolt into more than a 1/4 inch to coat all the threads as you screw the bolt in the hole. It should be available at any civilian/private aircraft supply house. It may have the mil spec of -555 on the label, if it does, that's the good stuff.

Ron

 

[greensmurf20]

"It's an Air Force thing, seen too many reports of the wrong hardware causing accidents and loss of life. " origionally posted by namaba

another story that ephasizes the correct use of hardware. last night i was riding my 89 yamaha exciter, little bit of work ot it. re clutched, studed, mild racing suspension and free flow exhaust with dual Mikuni carbs, 570 EX motor. well i had the hammer down and was ridin it hard, finally dropped the front skis at about 45 MPH, and at about 60-70MPH i hit a small dip in the field, i always do and its never a big deal. one bolt in my suspension broke that held the top bogy to the tub. well because of that bolt breaking, the suspension dropped up into the tub, took out one of the heat exchangers, the track got too loose when that bogy bolt broke, and the drive cogs on the track slipped, and since i had the hammer down and i just landed it from probaly a 1 or 2 foot jump, it was on alot of load, and when the cogs slipped, it was like breaking the belt and going on a free-rev. was spinning 7500 RPM, and all the sudden the tach maxed out, which is over 10,000 and the thing just died, both clutches locked up also, and i can only figure it died because it "hand grenaded" my motor. hopefully its OK, but i have doubts, i havent had a chance to check it out after i finally got hit home from the fields. moral of the story:

just one little bolt messed up my heat exchanger, primary and secondary clutch are now jamed in full speed operation, and my motor is probably wasted. and it all could have been prevented if i would have bought a better bolt for 50 cents at the hardware instead of using one i found in the barn. so a 50 cent piece just ruined a 1500 dollar sled, pretty mild compared to some of the things certain people do to our opels, a 5 dollar part coulda saved a 5-6 thousand dollar car. just another story to get this point acrossed, not a shame i wasted the sled, but a shame to know i have all that time and money into it, it all seem slike a waste over one little bolt.

 

[greensmurf20]

well not sure about the motor yet, but i busted the primary clutch out of it too. must have been a good reason the clutch assembly has stamped right on it "never revolve engine more than 10,500 RPM" i spun it just about 12000

 

[Washout]

I know that no one here would make this kind of blunder but I just disassemble a 69' 1.9 and found so much RTV that the oil pickup was completely blocked with the stuff. This is one time where too much is a bad thing.

 

[jordan]

there should be be more of a safety margin than 1500 rpm before it reaches its point of catastrophic failure (which it did ) rope usually has about a 50% safety margin 1000lb test rope may not snap until 1500lbs but the clutch would probily be a slimmer safety margin..if it was 50% it most likely wont fail until 15750, but why waste the possibility to rev it more.

 

[greensmurf20]

we all love to wind em up and let em rip.....point is the motor never woulda wound up like that if i woulda bought a bolt instead of a old one in the barn. but yeah, clutch is screwed, 150 bucks is gone if i can scrap it up. might put my old twintrack raider back on the snow, it only needs new points.