[Injection]

Hi there!

So I own a Opel Senator A2 from 84' and I'd like to get something a lil' sweeter under it's hood. Originally it is 2,5 i (25NE), also I've got a 2,6 Dual Ram (C26NE) in corner and also a 3,0 i (C30NE). Maybe there's even a chance to get a 2,8 (28H, I guess) So I hope someone here could give me some tips for doin' a sweet combo, that would make my Sena flyin' :haha:. I've heard, that 2,8 has a 5 kg's (25 kg, maybe) lighter crank than 2,5 and 3,0 have. I was thinkin' of gettin' 2,6's Dual Ram onto 3,0 with 3,0 injectors and ECU. So shoot me with ur ideas.

 

[Injection]

Plus i have 1,9 (19E), 2,0 (20NE), 2,3 TD (23TD) and 2,3 D (23D)

 

[BQS4]

Is the 3.0 (C30NE) a 24V motor?

 

[Injection]

Is the 3.0 (C30NE) a 24V motor?

Nope it's CIH as most of them straight sixes

 

[wrench459 (R.I.P.)]

There was some ideas about converting the tall block 2.3D to gas.
Sorry can't find the thread.

 

[Injection]

There was some ideas about converting the tall block 2.3D to gas.
Sorry can't find the thread.

Hmm, sounds like it would have quite good chance of turboing . Anyway, my goal is to make it as fly as possible with the stock of parts that I have, without spendin' too much extra. Ofcourse new caskets, etc. are elementary things that I'm gonna' change anyway. I'm quite sure, there's lot of well known tune-ups for them StraightSix petrolburners , hope that someone could share some with me. Reason, I'm searchin' for a combo, is that I have a chance to use parts of prementioned engines and I'd like to have something interesting done, so, it could beat them BMW-s, like e36 525 (m50b25)

 

[wrench459 (R.I.P.)]

Ya got anything with a crossflow cylinder head?

 

[Injection]

Ya got anything with a crossflow cylinder head?

Nope, all of them should be reverse-flow heads. I think I should note, that I'm not native english-speaker and I may not understand all termins

 

[ggl]

Anyway, my goal is to make it as fly as possible with the stock of parts that I have, without spendin' too much extra.

The C30NE is your best bet then but if you're not prepared to spend money there isn't a whole lot you can do. I assume you could always put the head from the 2.6 on it to raise compression but as far as I can remember that head has smaller valves so whatever you gain in compression ratio you're probably giving up in gas flow

The Dual Ram system was never intended to give extra hp but better bottom end torque so there's isn't much performance to be had there either, if any

The way I see it, and assuming you have the 177 hp version of the C30NE, all you can do really is start spending money on a head/valve job or sell all your spare engines and use the money towards a C30SEJ (24v) engine

 

[Injection]

The C30NE is your best bet then but if you're not prepared to spend money there isn't a whole lot you can do. I assume you could always put the head from the 2.6 on it to raise compression but as far as I can remember that head has smaller valves so whatever you gain in compression ratio you're probably giving up in gas flow

What about fitting 30's valves to 26's head? 30's head that I'm goin' to get should be in porting.

The Dual Ram system was never intended to give extra hp but better bottom end torque so there's isn't much performance to be had there either, if any

I guess, I'd kinda like to get some etxtra punch from low rpms, I was gonna' install this intake because of this anyway.

The way I see it, and assuming you have the 177 hp version of the C30NE, all you can do really is start spending money on a head/valve job or sell all your spare engines and use the money towards a C30SEJ (24v) engine

Actually, I'm not really 100% sure bout', which one I'm gonna' get in my hands. How to make it sure? Askin' cause, as you know, they both have same code.

We haven't 24V's much in here, cause all have been fried already . So I'm trying to combine something up on my own, just to create something interesting and to get something better than my 2,5 A/T provides.

Aswell I have a little dilemma, what ECU and injectiors should I use, aswell whichone's camshaft I should use.

 

[wrench459 (R.I.P.)]

If you thinking about aftermarket units SDS make a very stable stand alone.
EM-4 Specifications

 

[ggl]

Well, of the engines you have access to the 2.6 is the most "modern" one in terms of age, which can be either good or bad, so chances are Opel did a little optimization on the ports to get a little bit more performance out of it compared to the older 2.5 so it's probably the better starting point, but that's a "best guess" on my part and I really don't know the six cylinder engines that well so I may be way off here

I'm really just guessing here but the 3.0 with the 2.6 head with some work done to it and the valves from the 3.0 ..... that's what I'd start out with. I'd keep the injection and everything else from the 3.0 though, unless you plan on going aftermarket. (the one suggested above looks pretty decent)

In the end you're gonna have to spend money, on the head job and on a decent camshaft, because no matter how you combine the stock parts you have I can't see it giving you much of a performance boost, just a little bit better starting point

 

[Injection]

If you thinking about aftermarket units SDS make a very stable stand alone.
EM-4 Specifications

Looks kinda' great. I have kept in mind programmable standalone, but as you know, it needs some money at first as everything . I have checked MS. So at first i still have to stick with OEM.

 

[Injection]

Well, of the engines you have access to the 2.6 is the most "modern" one in terms of age, which can be either good or bad, so chances are Opel did a little optimization on the ports to get a little bit more performance out of it compared to the older 2.5 so it's probably the better starting point, but that's a "best guess" on my part and I really don't know the six cylinder engines that well so I may be way off here

So it should be . I'll try to find valves dimensions.

I'm really just guessing here but the 3.0 with the 2.6 head with some work done to it and the valves from the 3.0 ..... that's what I'd start out with. I'd keep the injection and everything else from the 3.0 though, unless you plan on going aftermarket. (the one suggested above looks pretty decent)

So that's where I try to aim from now, I guess. ECU should be OEM, cause as you know, aftermarket's cost a lil' more, someday I'll get one! .

In the end you're gonna have to spend money, on the head job and on a decent camshaft, because no matter how you combine the stock parts you have I can't see it giving you much of a performance boost, just a little bit better starting point

I'd like to get some guide for it's head porting, like i found for 1,9, where's shown, where to grind and how much, if there is something like that at all. Or maybe someone could guide me to some page? You're right, but as you know, anything needs money and at sec we have kinda' winter in here, so we try to keep our new bodyshop alive. This little project I'm workin' on is just something for summer fun. I ain't aiming for BIG extra, cause you know, every kW gain costs . I was kinda' hopin' that someone, who knows SS (Straight 6 ) engines well, would give some hints.

 

[Motor Mouth]

Hi Injection,

I've only just picked up your messages, sorry for the delay.

It's interesting to read your ideas for modification If you really wanted to make the A2 fly then some of the options to consider would be a 3.6/3.9litre 12valve Irmscher lump or a 4.0litre 24valve engine, that'll be putting out 285ps in standard form .......i've discounted the Lotus Omega engine purely as it's crazily expesive.

If you want to keep it relatively low cost then, as you should have easy access, i would consider the 24valve Dual-ram conversion, 204ps out of the box, that's a big jump from 150ps in the 2.5litre. You should be able to pick up a nice set of cams, a bit of head work and you should achieve 250ps.

Hope that helps for starters?

 

[opelnut10]

Engine swap

So it should be . I'll try to find valves dimensions.



So that's where I try to aim from now, I guess. ECU should be OEM, cause as you know, aftermarket's cost a lil' more, someday I'll get one! .



I'd like to get some guide for it's head porting, like i found for 1,9, where's shown, where to grind and how much, if there is something like that at all. Or maybe someone could guide me to some page? You're right, but as you know, anything needs money and at sec we have kinda' winter in here, so we try to keep our new bodyshop alive. This little project I'm workin' on is just something for summer fun. I ain't aiming for BIG extra, cause you know, every kW gain costs . I was kinda' hopin' that someone, who knows SS (Straight 6 ) engines well, would give some hints.

The CIH engines all have basically the same layout and combustion chamber design. RallyBob has done a LOT of research and development on getting power out of these designs. Use the search and I'm sure you will find the information you are talking about as far as where and how much you need to grind. These engines do not respond to a lot of polishing in the ports but gringing in the right places can make power along with valve changes and cam profiles. If you have a long slow winter there that is the time to take on this project and save yourself some money by doing it yourself. View photos and read discriptions until you feel comfortable about doing the work.

 

[ggl]

The CIH engines all have basically the same layout and combustion chamber design. RallyBob has done a LOT of research and development on getting power out of these designs. Use the search and I'm sure you will find the information you are talking about as far as where and how much you need to grind.

Exactly, and the later six cylinder engines came with the same raised inlet ports as the 2.2/2.4 if I'm not mistaken, so his guides on porting those heads would probably be a better starting point than those for the older heads ..... ?

 

[ggl]

If you want to keep it relatively low cost then, as you should have easy access, i would consider the 24valve Dual-ram conversion, 204ps out of the box, that's a big jump from 150ps in the 2.5litre.

That's what I would do too, those 24v engines are something else and I can remember having some really fun times in my Omega 3.0 24v wagon, late night races with guys in BMW's and Mercs who had no idea what that car was all about.

Money wise it would probably not be more expensive than hotting up a 12v engine to the same performance level either and you'd have plenty of head room for more performance later on as funds allow

 

[Injection]

Thanks to you all. I'll try to search for porting guides, seems like it's one best mod's I could do. I guess 24V is quite hard to reach for to me, cause all we have had here, are fried and those, that still move, are in enthusiasts hands. So that means, you get fried one or decent for quite bigger price.

So, also I have a question about Opel's Injectors spec's and which one's are suited with which ECU's. And which wireing should I use? I have C26NE's total wireing (except tailights ) and 25NE's on my car. As I've read 2,6 is using LE-Jetronic and 3,0 Motronic, what difficulties may it cause in wireing? Also if 30ne's head isn't ported when I get it, I guess, I'll have to do it on myself. Any suggestion on valves?

 

[wrench459 (R.I.P.)]

..So, also I have a question about Opel's Injectors spec's and which one's are suited with which ECU's...

This is where the aftermarket shines. You can adjust battery correction,low slopes
and high slopes of any sized injector.


Without a way to hack into the programing of the ecm I would stick with the stock injectors thats calibrated to the puter.

The other tried and true method is stick some 16-17lbs buggers in. Get the car on the dyno with a wide band.
Have fun!