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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Manny, I'll let you know how my friend's 450 hp 2.4 CIH runs then....:)
 

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RallyBob said:
Manny, I'll let you know how my friend's 450 hp 2.4 CIH runs then....:)
That would be AWESOME Bob!!! What's he doing to it? It'd be great to keep it all OPEL. How's he going to get the power to the ground?

Keep me posted.
 

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Well Manny, it's almost more my engine than my friend's. I'm designing/building it, he's paying for it!

It's a 2.4 bored out to 2.5 litres, with 8.7:1 compression custom Venolias that have been ceramic coated, H-11 tool steel pins, Total Seal rings, ARP rod bolts, polished/shotpeened/balanced rods, o-ringed block, copper head gasket.

The head is also a 2.4 head, with 1.94" intake and 1.60" exhaust valves and pretty much 'maximum' porting. It has titanium retainers, a 'mild' roller cam, roller rockers, a stud girdle, diesel oil pump cover with extended gears, a custom fabricated turbo header, custom fabricated intake manifold, 70 mm throttle body, TEC-2 programmable EFI and ignition, Turbosmart wastegate, Forge blow-off valve, custom Swedish-built intercooler, and a ball-bearing Garrett GT30R turbocharger.

The only things that are not completed at this time are the manifolds, and the turbo still needs to be ordered. But all the hard parts are ready to go together. It'll also have a Getrag 265 tranny and a 3.91 Toyota truck rear axle, plus an aluminum flywheel and S-10 clutch. I will definitely have progress reports as it commences....
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
gtzero said:
I can't seem to stop drooling!
Well, with 450 hp you just stick your head out the window and the drool dries right up....

Seriously though, I'm a bit concerned about traction. A friend of mine used to have a 409 hp (at the wheels) SR20DE (not a DET, it was an aftermarket installation) Nissan in a front-wheel drive Sentra. His car had bad wheelspin to about 80 mph. But in a roll-out race against a CBR900, he simply pulled away from the bike from 100-178 mph (his rev limiter).

I'm hoping that with the weight transfer of rear-wheel drive and DOT racing tires, we'll hook up by 60 mph at least.
 

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Please keep us updated on this bob, I am building a very similar engine. I'm a bit worried about the rear end, so im sticking with small tires for now hoping to lose traction before stuff breaks (just a matter of time i know). A few questions about the cih turbo engine, a bit ot but he since he brought it up ;) Are you going to run an water-air intercooler or water injection? Does the intercooler being built in switerland make it go faster :p If your going with an air-air intercooler I'd look into an intercooler cooler. They spray nos or co2 across the face of the intercooler and really increase the efficenty (kindof like a nos shot, have a magic gofast button mounted in the cabin, 'cheap' way to get an extra 60-100hp). What boost levels are you shooting for? Where did you get your throttle body? And can i get a copy of your fuel and ignition curves when you've got it mapped? Lots of question I know, but I'd appreciate your comments on the above. Also, make sure to take as many pics as you reasonable can. I really would like to see the designs of the headers and intake manifolds. Good luck to you with it.



Back to topic. From my experiances, non opel, big wheels make a fantastic difference....in the dry. In the snow and rain (or generally slick conditions) they can cause trouble (especially with a 'race' or 'summer' tire). Stock tires to a 205 isint too large of jump. It will be a stiffer ride, but i personally like stiff rides. I feel they look better, perform MUCH better in dry conditions. And with the proper tire can perform fantastic on snow as well (if you get a cleated tire or something similar). The grip is truly amazing with large 'sticky' tires on a winding road in the middle of the summer, defintly a fun time to be had. Ive never noticed it harder to turn in....other then im usualy going faster ;) My gt is going to get large tires when the rear end is sorted and im confident in the drive train.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
kmon said:
Please keep us updated on this bob, I am building a very similar engine. I'm a bit worried about the rear end, so im sticking with small tires for now hoping to lose traction before stuff breaks (just a matter of time i know). A few questions about the cih turbo engine, a bit ot but he since he brought it up ;) Are you going to run an water-air intercooler or water injection? Does the intercooler being built in switerland make it go faster :p If your going with an air-air intercooler I'd look into an intercooler cooler. They spray nos or co2 across the face of the intercooler and really increase the efficenty (kindof like a nos shot, have a magic gofast button mounted in the cabin, 'cheap' way to get an extra 60-100hp). What boost levels are you shooting for? Where did you get your throttle body? And can i get a copy of your fuel and ignition curves when you've got it mapped? Lots of question I know, but I'd appreciate your comments on the above. Also, make sure to take as many pics as you reasonable can. I really would like to see the designs of the headers and intake manifolds. Good luck to you with it.
It will have an air-to-air intercooler. It is fairly large in surface area, so I will rely on this for all charge cooling. I will use a water sprayer for the intercooler only for warmer weather, and probably boost-dependant. That is, it will only activate at higher levels of boost.

I'm familiar with intercooler NOS sprayers, but as that's really only a drag racing thing, I'm not going to apply it here. This is for road use and for some road-racing track use. Still gotta carry the bottle somewhere too!

I think that for road use and pump gas, boost will remain at about 10 psi. This should still break 325 hp. According to an engineerI know at Garrett, I should be able to get away with 18 psi boost on pump gas with that turbo and intercooler. Those GT-series Garretts are a lot more efficient than the older T-series turbos. In fact, that same turbo should boost nicely to about 25-26 psi if we run racing fuel, and could theoretically get about 500 crank hp.

Throttle body is a $180 Ford 5.0 aftermarket part. Injectors are $89 a piece however, you can't get around the fact that we're gonna need 96 lb-hr injectors to make that kind of power.

HTH
 

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talking bout wheel and tire sizes ever try drivin a gt that has 4 diffrent tires all un-balanced and all at diffrent air pressures and also with a slight mis-allignment in the front, well its not to fun with ur gt shacking all the way down the road although it does look kinda cool i heard....i say jus run stock size tires and wheels maybe not the steel wheels but some sort of alloy or such 13 inch rim.
 

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RallyBob said:
It will have an air-to-air intercooler. It is fairly large in surface area, so I will rely on this for all charge cooling. I will use a water sprayer for the intercooler only for warmer weather, and probably boost-dependant. That is, it will only activate at higher levels of boost.
HTH
Hey Bob,

Are you familiar with the AQUAMIST system that is used in Rally cars? I just realized how stupid that question was. :)

Anyways, do you have a time frame for this project. I'm seriously interested in the results and the cost breakdown.

Manny
 

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Aquimist is an okay setup but really expensive for what you are getting. Take a look at this page diy electronic watercooling and read all 5 parts. Very good info on a cheap system that looks to be a pretty nice setup. My plan is useing a few extra injector outputs on the megasquirt module to handle the water. Water injector was dicussed a bit earlier so need to delv into too many details, but bascily its a really cheap way to gain some serious power on forced induction engines. Using this method vw sandrails have run over 25lbs of boost without detonation.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
gtzero said:
Hey Bob,

Are you familiar with the AQUAMIST system that is used in Rally cars? I just realized how stupid that question was. :)
Yes, I'm quite familiar with it. It's also VERY expensive, over $500. I'll make my own system. It won't have 100 psi, only 60 or so, but it'll be adequate.

Anyways, do you have a time frame for this project. I'm seriously interested in the results and the cost breakdown.

Manny
[/QUOTE]

Not really. The car owner is currently unemployed, so I have no urgency to fabricate the final parts since it can't be put together until the last few buy-outs are in my hands. So it goes to the end of the line of my 23+- project cars list. I can probably do a cost analysis for the parts anyway, though you'd have to guess a price on the fabrication work and engine prep work.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Manny, I didn't copy the entire cost breakdown here, but in a nutshell when I added the engine parts/machine labor, cooling system, exhaust system, turbo components, and fuel system up, it came to $11,792.00 including the original 2.4 engine. Add another 165 hours of labor to that by me. You get the idea....

If you want the entire step-by-step breakdown Manny, I'll e-mail it to you off-forum, as I think we've deviated enough from the original forum topic here!
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
jeff denton said:
That is a wicked engine you're building.
I want to know more about the "diesel oil pump with longer gears". Thanks!
Not needed for a naturally aspirated engine below 9000 rpms..... really the stock pump is quite adequate I've found.

But with this turbo engine, there is substantial plumbing for the oil cooler/remote filter/oil thermostat and the turbo must be fed pressurized oil as well. In this case, I thought it was a good idea.
 

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CIH Oil Pump

Risse Motor Sport in Germany make a pump kit with extended gears for more oil volume in super big CIH engines and for rallye motors with oil coolers and lots of pipe length etc.

Not needed for anything but the most radical motors!

Pic:
 

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Cast Iron Cover

I see that the Risse kit has an alloy cover plate.

The plate Bob mentions is from the Opel/Vauxhall Diesel Motor that is based upon the CIH designed block.

Part No. 3448844 I think, though the casting has xxxxx45 on it.

The major advantage of this cover is the steel relief valve as some of the alloy covers have plastic valves !!!

Pic:
 

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The Risse high volume oil pump is in the reviews section along with a link to Risse. I have that set-up with the cast cover in my 3.0E Senator. Got both of them from Risse. When I bought the cast cover, they discounted the cost of the alloy cover from the pump.
 

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Hi Bob,

I'd be very interested in the breakdown. But no rush. I'm short on funds as well as your friend. :) I'm in the middle of one project already.

Maybe we can hook up at the OMC picnic.
 

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this is sort of off topic.... but are you talking about a nissan 2.4 litre or a factory 2.4 litre from opel gt source. and by the way i have been part of this forum for about 7 months now and i am really getting to know the opel community. the engine that you are building sounds very interesting, since i am looking into boring and stroking my opel too.

this car that you are talking about is crazy and i hope it goes well.

- Jesse
 
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