Opel GT Forum banner

1 - 12 of 12 Posts

·
Life Long Opeler
Joined
·
692 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Ok, now for HELP!!!!

Here is my problem. Ive put in fresh oil, gas, plugs, fluids, ets. Ive got a new Battery. As soon as I turned the key, I had a power light. I tried to crank it and it started to go for a fraction of a second and then nothing. After that...................no power light.

I checked with a volt meter to see that power was coming up to the starter and it was. Now. Ive just checked to see if I get power out of the starter by puting the voltmeter on the positive and negative terminals on the starter. I get nothing.

Safe to assume that I need a new starter??? Thoughts. Suggestions appreciated.
 

Attachments

·
Administrator
Joined
·
10,077 Posts
Remember.. the ground (any metal ground) is the negative. The "positive" terminal in your picture is the terminal from the starter switch.

If you want to by pass the key switch, jump the battery wire terminal to key switch terminal and the starter should crank.
 

·
Life Long Opeler
Joined
·
692 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Been there done that

Tried that and nothing. Ive done a voltmeter test that is in the Glenns book and Im thinking I might need a new cylanoyd or starter. :(
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
1,798 Posts
Options from an electrician

Voodoou,

There are 3 or 4 wires connected to the back of the opel starter solenoid. Two of them are rather large ones, one to the (+) of the battery (labeled 30) and the other into the armature of the motor itself (really short, uninsulated thick wire oppisite the battery one, going directly into the motor) Some starters have only 1 more (labeled 50) that goes to the start position of the ignition switch. Others still have a fourth one (labeled 16) that goes to the positive terminal of the ignition coil.

The first wire, from the battery, is self explanitory. The second big wire is the one that actually sends power to the starter motor. It is also attached with a 13mm wrench and should be identifiable.

The third one is the next one you need to test. Disconnect the 1/4" spade connected terminal farthest from the block (labeled (+) in you picture) and connect the (+) of your multimeter to the wire (not the terminal) with the (-) connected to a good chasis ground. Have a friend take the ignition switch to "start" and you should get +12V. If not, I'm sorry, you will need a new ignition switch, and they are really hard to come by. (You might need to get friendly with someone sitting on 2 NOS ones :D ) If you did get +12V at the wire, then the starter is immediatly suspect! (this is a good thing!)

Assuming the ignition switch was fine, reconnect the #3 wire you just got done testing, and disconnect the last small wire (if you have one.) This wire is to supply +12V to the coil, bypassing the in line resistor wire, to give you a "hotter" spark at start-up, but only for a limited time (to prevent burning-up your coil.) Some cars don't use them, some do, even after 30 years the verdict is still out on whether or not it is necessary.

Now with the 4th wire disconnected, if you have one, and the one from the ignition switch connected, find your helper again and have them take the ignition switch back to "start." Keep the (-) of you meter on a good chassis ground and check the 2 big and 1 small (if present) terminals on the solenoid. All 3 (both) should show +12V, and the starter should have "clunked." If they do the solenoid is fine, the starter motor is bad (still a good thing!) If the big terminal on the bottom doesn't show 12V, but you did get a clunk, you still may be fine, you will just have to recondition you solenoid (easy to do, really.)

If you got +12V on every terminal but the motor didn't turn, now is the time to make a decision. The motor is bad, but $60-85 at any auto electronics rebuilder will get you a rebuilt motor with no worries. If you won't or can't spend that then read on, we'll rebuild that motor together!

If the solenoid was bad you can do one more check with the starter in the car. Use your multimeter to test the resistance from the ignition switch terminal of the starter (labeled 50) to the big terminal closest to the starter motor. If you get much more than 10 ohms, the solenoid is really dead, you need a new one. If it is less than 10 ohms, around 7 say, we are still in business. This is the resistance of the coil, and the coil is hard to replace.

With a good resistance on the solenoid coil, it is time to start taking apart the starter itself. the first step is to remove the solenoid, which you do by taking the 2 screws at the flywheel end of the solenoid loose. When you get the solenoid off, clean the goo out of the screws on the terminal end of the solenoid and remove them. There should be a copper bar inside that is usually the problem with an Opel starter. It will probably be very pitted and corroded, especially after sitting for a few years. File or sand it to a nice polish, along with the terminals inside that it contacts, and put your perfectly working starter back in!

If the motor was the problem you will need to dissassemble it completely and clean the commutatur, where the brushes ride against the rotor, with a pencil eraser. Attention to detail is key, as is some ammount pf patience. It can be trying when small parts spring out at you.

If you attempted all of this, and now you have a pile of motor parts you don't know what to do with, let me know. I'll send you my address, and you can send me the motor to refurbish it or I can just send you another. One of the major skills the Navy did teach me is how to recondition DC motors! ;)
 

·
Life Long Opeler
Joined
·
692 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Cool, thanks

Ill give those a whirl when I get home from work this evening. One thing I should mention is that I have had to install a push button to start the car. Many years ago the tumblers in my ignition got worn out, so now I turn the key till I get a power light and then I hit the button. What changes to your explanation above, would that effect?

I might be missing a wire or something. I had only 3 wires attached to the solenoid. The battery wire and then 2 other wires. Those I believe are going to my starter button.

At any rate, Ill perform those tests tonight and let you know the situation. Thank you very much.

This board is GREAT and Ill be asking all of you for help. Thanks soooooo much in advance.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
1,798 Posts
pushbutton

The 2 wires on the starter push button should go from the battery (+) terminal (the big one with the 13mm nut) to the one you labeled as (+) in you picture. The other small wire should go to the (+) side of the coil (labeled 15 on the coil) but doesn't need to be hooked-up. That other big stud with a 13mm nut on it directly below the battery terminal on the solenoid does have a wire going to it, or at least a copper bar, otherwise the starter would have never worked. Good luck!
 

·
Life Long Opeler
Joined
·
692 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Copper wire

Yes, I believe it is going to a copper wire. Thank you. Im taking this thing off tonight and remove all the goo. I am assumming that it comes off in one piece and the soledoid and starter are not separate. At least thats the way it looks.
 

·
Opeler
Joined
·
159 Posts
solenoid, starter or both?

when i turn the key i get a click but no real starter noises. the screwdriver hotwire trick sparks but that's about it, no starter noise. following oldopelguy's directions i took my trusty multimeter and started testing. i get 11 volts or from the ignition switch, 12 to the battery terminal on the solenoid, nothing to the lower terminal on the solenoid and about 7 volts to the 4th terminal (resistor wire bypass). so it reads like a bad solenoid but shouldn't i get some signs of life from the starter?

bob
 

·
Member
Joined
·
199 Posts
rsefczek said:
when i turn the key i get a click but no real starter noises. the screwdriver hotwire trick sparks but that's about it, no starter noise. following oldopelguy's directions i took my trusty multimeter and started testing. i get 11 volts or from the ignition switch, 12 to the battery terminal on the solenoid, nothing to the lower terminal on the solenoid and about 7 volts to the 4th terminal (resistor wire bypass). so it reads like a bad solenoid but shouldn't i get some signs of life from the starter?

bob
No, if the windings in the starter motor are not feed with ample voltage or current flow the magnetic field will not be sufficient to spin the armature and it will sit there in limbo with a weak magnetic field. The bushings in the motor may be frozen or the windings in the motor may be bad as well. If the solenoid clicks it may be hanging up internally and not completing the ckt. Disassemble it and clean it or get a new one. You can check the motor it's self by applying 12VDC directly to the lower stud. The motor should spin but should not engage the flywheel this way unless something else is wrong with it. Be careful doing this especially if the starter is out of the car as the motor's torque can send the starter flipping around.


P.S. You shouldn’t get any voltage at the lower stud on the starter/solenoid unless the solenoid is engaged.
hth
Brian
 

·
Member
Joined
·
199 Posts
If there is no voltage at the lower stud with the ignition switch in the START position, not the ON position, and there is voltage at the upper stud then yes it is most likely a solenoid problem.

Brian
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
616 Posts
rsefczek said:
when i turn the key i get a click but no real starter noises. the screwdriver hotwire trick sparks but that's about it, no starter noise. following oldopelguy's directions i took my trusty multimeter and started testing. i get 11 volts or from the ignition switch, 12 to the battery terminal on the solenoid, nothing to the lower terminal on the solenoid and about 7 volts to the 4th terminal (resistor wire bypass). so it reads like a bad solenoid but shouldn't i get some signs of life from the starter?

bob
sounds alot like my problem, turns out i was being stupid and forgot the ground strap from the block to the frame, once that was bolted in place it turned over like it was brand new! (in case you don't know, its on the passenger side of the engine, waaay down at the bottom)
 
1 - 12 of 12 Posts
Top