[jstock]

I am selling my GT on e-bay. I rec'd these e-mails. Item 2490989714

Looks suspicious. Any thoughts ??



Question about your item

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 7:10 AM
To: Stockhausen, James
Subject: Question for item #2490989714 - Opel : All Models

Dear jstock0540,

HELLO, I AM AN AUTO DEALER WITH WELL OVER FIFTEEN YEARS EXPERIENCE. MY CLIENT HAS JUST PLACED AN ORDER WANTING A BRAND OF YOUR VEHICLE.I WOULD LIKE TO ENQUIRE IF YOU WOULD PREFER A CASHIER'S CHECK AS THE MODE OF PAYMENT. IF THE ANSWER IS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE,MY CLIENT HAS CATEGORICALY ASSURED ME THAT HE WOULD DRAW UP A CASHIER'S CHECK TO OFFSET THE COST OF THE VEHICLE AS WELL AS ALL SHIPPING/INSURANCE CHARGES FROM THE USA TO THE POINT OF DESTINATION.THIS SIMPLY MEANS THAT THE PAYMENT WILL INCLUDE THE ITEM'S COST, MY AGENCY COMMISSION,AS WELL AS DELIVERY COSTS FROM THE BASE POINT TO THE POINT OF DESTINATION. MY AGENCY TERMS STIPULATE THAT THE AGENCY COMMISSION AND DELIVERY COSTS MUST BE WIRED VIA WESTERN UNION THE SAME DAY THE CHECK IS RECEIVED.IF THIS CONDITION IS ACCEPTED THEN I WILL DIRECT MY CLIENT TO PREPARE THE PAYMENT ARRANGEMENTS IMMEDIATELY.REPLY ME IN FIVE HOURS IF AGENCY TERMS ARE ACCEPTED.


-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 3:11 PM
To: Stockhausen, James
Subject: Question for item #2490989714 - Opel : All Models



Question about your item



Dear jstock0540,

Hello, I am using this medium to notify you of my interest in buying your item on behalf of my client. I am an agent of 30years expirience based in UK and also travell as well. with chains of clients across the west African coast. My client has specifically given me a quote and placed an order for your particular brand of unit hence the need to get in touch with you on the negotiations. I will want to ask if you would accept a certified cashier check from my client as a mode of payment. If yes , please forward ASAP your postal contact details, your telephone numbers and the name which you want the check to be addresssed to . I am counting on your support in concluding this transaction within the shortest possible time. moreover,abt the shippment my shipping agent will handle that cos thier will be a excess funds on the check which you will wire to my shipping agent thru western for transport of the unit. i will in include $250 for the inconviniences. GUESS LOTER.

Please respond to the question on eBay by clicking the button below. You'll have the option to display your response directly on the listing.

 

[RallyBob]

It's a scam, I know of many racers/rally drivers who've been approached with this exact same scenario. Tell them to show up with cash, or no deal.....

 

[ging]

These two are whopping big scams. This is what they try to do. They either try to get you to send the 'shipping cost' and or other fees by Western Union before you receive the cashiers check or they send the check and immediately want you to send the excess amounts to cover these items. Here's the problem. If you send money before the check arrives you will never hear from them again. If you wait for the check and send the money you will find out the check is bogus. The bank will tell you quite clearly that it takes time to find out a check is bad and you will have to pay back any money that the check was supposed to cover. Plus, the 'commission and shipping extra' on the check that you turned around to send Western Union to them is gone. That's why they offer $2500.00 extra (which is a big tip-off - who would do that?) for your time or ask that this all be done in hours. That gives you no time to check things out thoroughly. Plus, in the second email, check out all the spelling and grammatical mistakes. That's always a big honking red siren that things are not as they appear.
These people also send emails to people with cars for sale elsewhere on the web. Usually it's someone from somewhere like Nigeria (one that I received) that 'buys cars' for some anonymous client overseas and wants yours. Now, why would they want my '85 Mazda?
No phone number, no address... . Wait and see if they contact you again. Bet they don't.
Send these to ebay (they have a scam, etc, email for that) and they should send you back an email that will tell you whether or not they have received other reports like this and if it's a scam in their book. I'm betting anyone with a car for sale right now has gotten them.
Having seen these before,
Ging

 

[Excelsior]

You could have fun and lead them on a little. Make them wait to pay or something and then when they do send that bogus check, they ended up paying up the wazoo to actually send it to you via postage.

If you don't mind giving your address out that is. Or use a PO BOX.

This way we can at least hear a good story from a member. And don't forget to contact the bank it was written on in the US as well as your local police dept. These checks are extremely difficult to tell if counterfeit.

 

[BDD]

Go ahead. Waste some of their time for a change. I think I remember seeing warnings at Ebay not to do money transactions involving Western Union? Maybe it's because of scams like this.

Have you ever gotten the one asking you to help out a government in Africa that wants you to keep $12,000,000 dollars or so in your bank account until their coup is over, or something like that? For this they will pay you a fee but, of course, they need you to first forward them a paltry amount; for the paperwork or licensing, etc.

Right.

 

[opeldean]

oh crap, i got a simiiar email when i posted my vintage bicycle for sale on a bicycle web site. For the next 100 years you will be receiving email written by the same groups of folks with different names and stories.they become very easy to spot.it is a scam of course. it will be hard to block them without special filtering software because they change their names each time. it dies down to 1 or 2 week scam emails a week , delete it and DO not answer it.by answereing you confirm your email address.

somwehow your email is out. I have been there.I suppose its harmless

 

[jstock]

Thanks for the insight. I had the same e-mails when I listed the car, trans and 2.2.
I would really like to mess with these guys.
My problem is that in the outside chance that they turned out to be legit, then what ?
If any of you have some creative, well thought ideas how I can screw these guys, I'd be willing to listen.
I already contacted e-bay to see what they know.
Below is a reply from one of the 2 potential buyers.

Subject : URGENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HI,
I GOT YOUR MAIL AND AM VERY GREATFUL FOR YOUR REPLY I WILL WANT YOUR TO END THIS AUCTION FOR ME OK BECAUES I WANT MY CLIENT TO BUY THIS CAR FROM YOU AND I REALLY LIKE THE WAY YOU REPLY ME . YES AM REGISTERED ON E-BAY OK. I AM NOT THE ONE THAT SEND YOU THAT E-MAIL OK , EACH MAIL THAT I SEND TO MY CLIENT , MY NAME WILL BE THERE TO IDENTIFY ME OK I AM NOT WORKING FOR THE SAME CLIENT OK .I WANT YOU TO MAIL YOUR FULL CONTACT ADDRESS AND PHONE NUMBER , SO I WILL FORWARD IT TO MY CLIENT TO ISSUE THE CHECK IN THE INFORMATION YOU WILL MAIL TO ME .

THANKS AND GOD BLESS YOU .
REPLY ME ASAP.

REGARDS,

GUESS LOTER.

 

[jstock]

One more thought
Do they actually come and get the car ?
This scam is about getting money, not really interested in the car. So I wonder what happens to the car ?
They must have someone in the US that they will contract to pick up the car, but I doubt they go to the expense to actually ship it overseas. I wonder if they just scrap it ?
JLS

 

[Scott McDonald]

They never get the car. It is all about scamming you out of the first transaction.
Their check bounces the following day(for the car, expenses, tax...), and your bank, drains your account in the amount of the bogus check.
Now, you have already wired the money to them, thinking you have their check in your bank.
When the bank resends this bogus check, the only negative funds will be found in your account.
Finally, those guys who scammed you aren't heard from again. The scam artists are done with you the instant you wired them the money on the first day, long before your bank discovers the fraudulent check.

So, you'll get to keep your car-minus any funds you gave away. I believe this is/was the FBI's #1 rated internet scam.

Who would send excess money? Why would they pay you for your inconvenience, when it would be far less expensive for them to just cut another check for taxes, transport...? If they require payment "wired" internationally, why should you expect anything less?

Have the clients agency wire to you, via Western Union, the cost, shipping...Then tell the "broker", you'll be happy to subsequently wire via Western Union the excess. How could he bitch? It would be a whole lot faster that way.

 

[opelgt722002]

Just saw this website mentioned in the newspaper .

www.reversescam.com

This is from the website :"The whole idea of this website is to turn online scammers into victims. It's just that simple.

If you aren't aware, a really popular scam right now is the Nigerian 419 scam, it goes a little something like this. The person that emails you usually has some really important title that commands respect and they have a sob story, rough life, war torn nation, blah, blah and how they have a huge amount of money that they need to move out of the country, usually Nigeria. This is where you come in, if you only provide them with your bank account numbers, etc they can wire it over to you. What a great deal! Once you provide them with the information, instead of depositing the money, they go ahead and steal all of yours. So you in fact, don't get the millions of dollars

To get these bastards back I began writing as different characters to see just how long they would put up with me and perhaps get to know them a little better. Anyway, I figure it's good for a laugh and while they are busy writing me they can't steal some poor dumbasses money. I swear that all of these letters are 100% real, I'm posting them exactly as I get them.

Thanks for stopping by, spread the word, please forward this to whoever you want, and actually if you have received one of these scam emails and you want me to contact them, or you want to chat, or hell even if you want to send me your bank account numbers, please contact me using the form above."

 

[GTJIM (R.I.P.)]

These scammers want two things:
1) If you are dumb enough - money directly from you
2) Your identity - name; address; telephone number; bank a/c number

The second is the prize as they can use that info to pose as you and scam others so that an FBI investigation ends up at you door step.

Unless you are VERY creative just ignore them and delete the emails as they arrive or extreme strife can result.

 

[jstock]

Anyone have the FBI's address handy ? I could just give the scammers that address.
JLS

 

[BDD]

No, give the FBI theirs.

 

[jstock]

I called the FBI earlier today. They took the e-mail address of the guys. They just put the info in a data base. I told the FBI that I was hoping to set them up. They said this one is kind of tough to fight from their end.

 

[72GT]

This is somewhat related: About 5 years ago, I replied to a spam email, because I was sick of seeing them appear in my work mailbox. (And compared to now, the volume of spam was much less!)
If I recall correctly, my message was something along the lines "...starting today, I will charge a fee to read your emails, at something dollars per email... blah blah blah"
Not really a threatening letter, but I guess I felt powerless to stop the spammer.
Anyway, it sort of made me feel better, but within 24 hours many of my co-workers began getting spam, including the president of the company, with the "sender address" being my email address!!
It was embarassing, but since then I've never responded to any spam, I try to pretend I don't exist.
Of course, now everyone is familiar with a spoofed "from" addresses and the other evil junk.

 

[ging]

These people are smart in one area. Using the system. As 72GT said, they will just paste your email address in their emails (though this doesn't affect the actual 'received from' address in the header - usually) but that's not the really smart part. You really don't want to respond as then they know they've contacted someone (most of these are mass mailings and they only respond to the ones that in turn respond to the first email) and will follow that lead as far as possible. They keep their own same addresses but will often switch computers, locations (this is a group of people) and hard drives to help confuse the I.P. designation (there's a lot more involved in that but that's the basics) that would make them easy to find. They're very careful to avoid using the US postal service because that would put them in Federal and felony categories. Fedex, UPS, and Western Union all fall into private categories. Interpol is truthfully more concerned with a bit more dangerous areas than this type of international fraud so they know they are fairly safe from international attention and prosecution.
That little bit of advice we all get about changing passwords frequently and making them something other than personal info like birthdays and also containing letters and numbers is really phenomenally important and effective. Using letters and numbers makes algorithims to determine passwords much more difficult. The information available on the web makes your birthdays, children's names, pet's names, relative's names, all these birthdays, etc, very easy to determine. Plus, spyware and viruses, worms, and other hacks can sometimes infiltrate your computer and send out the info it picks up in your drive to the origination point next time you sign onto the net. A spyware detection program is a worthwhile and possibly invaluable investment. Yesterday my program picked up 31 items that were suspect and luckily mine were all cookies that were not a problem. However I have run it before and found various items that were spyware and so far, thank God, fairly harmless info collectors of the statistical type. But... they did get in. Then they got wiped from the face of my hard drive world.
Well that's my 50 cents. Just change those passwords and be aware.
Ging

 

[PROPEL]

They're very careful to avoid using the US postal service because that would put them in Federal and felony categories. Fedex, UPS, and Western Union all fall into private categories.

Minor correction... they're in the Federal felony category just by virtue of using the Internet to perpetrate a fraud, regardless of the method of payment or its delivery.

 

[nobody]

If this is on Ebay amend your sale to include that for international sales Escrow will be used. Until their funds clear escrow you are not involved. Then Don't respond to thier Email if they want it they will have to play by the rules.

 

[GoinManta]

Yep.. this scam is so bad its everywhere and not just on Ebay. Its a VERY common one used on those selling anything valuable online. I got the same types of Meails on the Bitter and my Pinball machines.

Charles

 

[ging]

You're right PROPEL. My mistake. Major brain-drain going on here... . Things have changed so much over the years. Sigh.